Screen Reading

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Screen Reading

Ken Saunders-2
This is probably not the best place for this question because it is
not Mozilla related, and I will find a better group. But anyway, it
appears that ZoomText does not read words well that have apostrophes
and words like I've, It's etc. I've will sound like ieeve.
Now the dumb question. Is this something that screen reader users just
deal with? I ask because one of my websites is being re-written and I
want it to be as screen reader friendly as possible.
Thanks
Ken

Ken Saunders
Administrator
www.SpreadFirefox.com

Owner/Operator
www.AccessFirefox.com

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Re: Screen Reading

Ken Saunders-2
On Mar 16, 6:27 pm, "Ken Saunders" <[hidden email]>
wrote:

> This is probably not the best place for this question because it is
> not Mozilla related, and I will find a better group. But anyway, it
> appears that ZoomText does not read words well that have apostrophes
> and words like I've, It's etc. I've will sound like ieeve.
> Now the dumb question. Is this something that screen reader users just
> deal with? I ask because one of my websites is being re-written and I
> want it to be as screen reader friendly as possible.
> Thanks
> Ken
>
> Ken Saunders
> Administratorwww.SpreadFirefox.com
>
> Owner/Operatorwww.AccessFirefox.com

Great info, thank you for the knowledge and your time.
Ken

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RE: Screen Reading

Sina Bahram
In reply to this post by Ken Saunders-2
It is true that apostrophes are interesting with screen readers, but no,
I've sounds like ive, as in it sounds correct. Typing about how something
sounds always is interesting with a screen reader :).

Take care,
Sina

-----Original Message-----
From: [hidden email]
[mailto:[hidden email]] On Behalf Of Ken
Saunders
Sent: Friday, March 16, 2007 7:28 PM
To: [hidden email]
Subject: Screen Reading

This is probably not the best place for this question because it is not
Mozilla related, and I will find a better group. But anyway, it appears that
ZoomText does not read words well that have apostrophes and words like I've,
It's etc. I've will sound like ieeve.
Now the dumb question. Is this something that screen reader users just deal
with? I ask because one of my websites is being re-written and I want it to
be as screen reader friendly as possible.
Thanks
Ken

Ken Saunders
Administrator
www.SpreadFirefox.com

Owner/Operator
www.AccessFirefox.com

_______________________________________________
dev-accessibility mailing list
[hidden email]
https://lists.mozilla.org/listinfo/dev-accessibility

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Re: Screen Reading

Gregory J. Rosmaita
In reply to this post by Ken Saunders-2
aloha, ken - i've never used ZoomText personally, but i have
installed it for a number of other users and have been a screen
reader only user for 15 years...

here are a couple of things you should look up in the ZoomText help
files:

1. can you set punctuation rules?  you should be able to set
punctuation rules (so that the TTS engine treats them as cues (a
comma a pause; a semi-colon, a slightly longer pause; a period a full
stop (if reading by sentence, or, if reading a block of text, a still
slightly longer pause) - you should also be able to set the level of
punctuation spoken (all, most, some, none), depending upon the type
of material you're reading or work you are doing...

2. does ZoomText offer you an application-specific dictionary (as
well as a global, default dictionary) which allows you to quote
correct unquote mispronunciations - for example, i have always had to
set a rule for my surname, forcing the screen reader to pronounce it
phonetically - ross may tuh - rather than the usual ross mi ata

[side note - the reason i spell out quote, unquote, and slash is so
that, when listening with speak punctuation off, leaving it to the
timing cues (or, if i desired, aural icons, which sound every time
punctuation mark x is detected), which means that when listening to
email or web documents, i find that punctuation marks can be speech
killers - especially when in a word by word mode - an eddress such as

[hidden email]

is spoken as only quote gregory quote, as the use of punctuation
rules tell the TTS engine i'm using: quote here is a period - you
have reached the end of a sentence, so stop speaking unquote]

this is also why one needs to set dictionary entries for ascii
smileys, which to those of us who listen to email with speak
punctuation turned off, are aurally invisible - one must set:

:P (colon capital P)

to indicate either amazement or that what was stated was stated
tongue-in-cheeck - at least, that's what i've been told - i'm not a
big fan of the emoticon, as i prefer to give my readers credit for
being able to distinguish when i am being serious and when sarcastic,
without taking cues from the smiley laugh track]

these are the simplest solutions to tailoring a text-to-speech engine
(hyphenated words are also problematic, if one is following
pronunciation rules, but has speak punctuation turned off; as in the
eddress example, when i run into a hyphenated phrase, i initially
only hear the first word, and have to return to the first word to
read it either part by part (using a speak next word command) or by
having the TTS engine read current word by character, which in my
case, results only in the spelling out of the first word, text,
preceding the first hyphen...

good luck, and don't be reluctant to ask more questions - there is
a general discussion list for ZoomText users, which you can join
by sending a blank emessage to:

[hidden email]
(that's zoomtext dash subscribe at egroups dot com)

more information about the ZoomText list can be found at:
[http://groups.yahoo.com/group/zoomtext/]

there is also an emailing list specifically for discussion of
different speech synthesizers, the Synth List; to subscribe send a
blank emessage to:

[hidden email]
(that's synthlist dash subscribe at onelist dot com)

more information on the group can be found at the following URL:
[http://tech.groups.yahoo.com/group/synthlist/]

(yes, yahoo has swallowed both eGroups and OneList)

in the best of all possible worlds, all TTS engines would support
aural cascading style sheets, SSML (Synthesized Speech Markup
Language), and other, standardized aural cueing and timing markup
languages, so that authors can define aural properties for pages, and
users can apply a default client side aural style sheet - optimally,
through a wizard interface, that would offer a user a choice of aural
and or visual cues to map to document specific markup for which no
default aural styling is defined, so that you don't need to know ACSS
or SSML to reap the benifits of both markup languages...

gregory.

---------- Original Message -----------
From: "Ken Saunders" <[hidden email]>
To: [hidden email]
Sent: 16 Mar 2007 16:27:36 -0700
Subject: Screen Reading

> This is probably not the best place for this question
> because it is not Mozilla related, and I will find a better
> group. But anyway, it appears that ZoomText does not read
> words well that have apostrophes and words like I've, It's
> etc. I've will sound like ieeve. Now the dumb question. Is
> this something that screen reader users just deal with? I
> ask because one of my websites is being re-written and I
> want it to be as screen reader friendly as possible. Thanks Ken
>
> Ken Saunders
> Administrator
> www.SpreadFirefox.com
>
> Owner/Operator
> www.AccessFirefox.com
>
> _______________________________________________
> dev-accessibility mailing list
> [hidden email]
> https://lists.mozilla.org/listinfo/dev-accessibility
------- End of Original Message -------

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Re: Screen Reading

Ken Saunders-2
In reply to this post by Ken Saunders-2
On Mar 17, 11:07 am, "Gregory J. Rosmaita" <[hidden email]> wrote:

> aloha, ken - i've never used ZoomText personally, but i have
> installed it for a number of other users and have been a screen
> reader only user for 15 years...
>
> here are a couple of things you should look up in the ZoomText help
> files:
>
> 1. can you set punctuation rules?  you should be able to set
> punctuation rules (so that the TTS engine treats them as cues (a
> comma a pause; a semi-colon, a slightly longer pause; a period a full
> stop (if reading by sentence, or, if reading a block of text, a still
> slightly longer pause) - you should also be able to set the level of
> punctuation spoken (all, most, some, none), depending upon the type
> of material you're reading or work you are doing...
>
> 2. does ZoomText offer you an application-specific dictionary (as
> well as a global, default dictionary) which allows you to quote
> correct unquote mispronunciations - for example, i have always had to
> set a rule for my surname, forcing the screen reader to pronounce it
> phonetically - ross may tuh - rather than the usual ross mi ata
>
> [side note - the reason i spell out quote, unquote, and slash is so
> that, when listening with speak punctuation off, leaving it to the
> timing cues (or, if i desired, aural icons, which sound every time
> punctuation mark x is detected), which means that when listening to
> email or web documents, i find that punctuation marks can be speech
> killers - especially when in a word by word mode - an eddress such as
>
> [hidden email]
>
> is spoken as only quote gregory quote, as the use of punctuation
> rules tell the TTS engine i'm using: quote here is a period - you
> have reached the end of a sentence, so stop speaking unquote]
>
> this is also why one needs to set dictionary entries for ascii
> smileys, which to those of us who listen to email with speak
> punctuation turned off, are aurally invisible - one must set:
>
> :P (colon capital P)
>
> to indicate either amazement or that what was stated was stated
> tongue-in-cheeck - at least, that's what i've been told - i'm not a
> big fan of the emoticon, as i prefer to give my readers credit for
> being able to distinguish when i am being serious and when sarcastic,
> without taking cues from the smiley laugh track]
>
> these are the simplest solutions to tailoring a text-to-speech engine
> (hyphenated words are also problematic, if one is following
> pronunciation rules, but has speak punctuation turned off; as in the
> eddress example, when i run into a hyphenated phrase, i initially
> only hear the first word, and have to return to the first word to
> read it either part by part (using a speak next word command) or by
> having the TTS engine read current word by character, which in my
> case, results only in the spelling out of the first word, text,
> preceding the first hyphen...
>
> good luck, and don't be reluctant to ask more questions - there is
> a general discussion list for ZoomText users, which you can join
> by sending a blank emessage to:
>
> [hidden email]
> (that's zoomtext dash subscribe at egroups dot com)
>
> more information about the ZoomText list can be found at:
> [http://groups.yahoo.com/group/zoomtext/]
>
> there is also an emailing list specifically for discussion of
> different speech synthesizers, the Synth List; to subscribe send a
> blank emessage to:
>
> [hidden email]
> (that's synthlist dash subscribe at onelist dot com)
>
> more information on the group can be found at the following URL:
> [http://tech.groups.yahoo.com/group/synthlist/]
>
> (yes, yahoo has swallowed both eGroups and OneList)
>
> in the best of all possible worlds, all TTS engines would support
> aural cascading style sheets, SSML (Synthesized Speech Markup
> Language), and other, standardized aural cueing and timing markup
> languages, so that authors can define aural properties for pages, and
> users can apply a default client side aural style sheet - optimally,
> through a wizard interface, that would offer a user a choice of aural
> and or visual cues to map to document specific markup for which no
> default aural styling is defined, so that you don't need to know ACSS
> or SSML to reap the benifits of both markup languages...
>
> gregory.
>
>
>
> ---------- Original Message -----------
> From: "Ken Saunders" <[hidden email]>
> To: [hidden email]
> Sent: 16 Mar 2007 16:27:36 -0700
> Subject: Screen Reading
>
> > This is probably not the best place for this question
> > because it is not Mozilla related, and I will find a better
> > group. But anyway, it appears that ZoomText does not read
> > words well that have apostrophes and words like I've, It's
> > etc. I've will sound like ieeve. Now the dumb question. Is
> > this something that screen reader users just deal with? I
> > ask because one of my websites is being re-written and I
> > want it to be as screen reader friendly as possible. Thanks Ken
>
> > Ken Saunders
> > Administrator
> >www.SpreadFirefox.com
>
> > Owner/Operator
> >www.AccessFirefox.com
>
> > _______________________________________________
> > dev-accessibility mailing list
> > [hidden email]
> >https://lists.mozilla.org/listinfo/dev-accessibility
>
> ------- End of Original Message -------

I'm new to ZoomText so I'm still kicking the tires.
I appreciate the feedback and I'm going to check it all out.
Oh, and the news group.


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