Re: Newsgroup policy and HTML

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Re: Newsgroup policy and HTML

»Q«
"Phillip M. Jones, C.E.T" <[hidden email]> wrote:

> David E. Ross wrote:
>
> > From <http://www.dtek.chalmers.se/~d97jorn/pgp/killhtml.html>:
> > "Parting with some of the capabilities of HTML, like the ability to
> > insert animated graphics of smiling faces, might actually be quite
> > beneficial for some.  Without them, they may just have to
> > rediscover the art of writing in order to convey their thoughts."
>
> I still don't see this knee jerk reaction to having even just the
> ability to boldface/ underline or Italicize words/phrases/ paragraphs
> to make a point.

That ability need not be tied to all the bloat of html.  Simple
pseudo-markup works:  *bold*, /italics/, _underline_.
 
> 9 times out of 10 if you just post the words its difficult to grasp
> the meaning if its just plain /generic.

If 90% of plain text is incomprehensible, I don't see how html can help.

followup set to m.general
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Re: Newsgroup policy and HTML

Tony Mechelynck
»Q« wrote:

> "Phillip M. Jones, C.E.T" <[hidden email]> wrote:
>
>> David E. Ross wrote:
>>
>>> From <http://www.dtek.chalmers.se/~d97jorn/pgp/killhtml.html>:
>>> "Parting with some of the capabilities of HTML, like the ability to
>>> insert animated graphics of smiling faces, might actually be quite
>>> beneficial for some.  Without them, they may just have to
>>> rediscover the art of writing in order to convey their thoughts."
>> I still don't see this knee jerk reaction to having even just the
>> ability to boldface/ underline or Italicize words/phrases/ paragraphs
>> to make a point.
>
> That ability need not be tied to all the bloat of html.  Simple
> pseudo-markup works:  *bold*, /italics/, _underline_.

I agree with »Q«. Bold, italics, and underlined, which can be achieved (with
mail readers such as Thunderbird) in plaintext, are OK. Even smiling :-)
frowning :-( or eye-blinking ;-) faces, if not overdone. But then I sometimes
see postings with all kinds of big and small fonts in all the colours of the
rainbow, looking more like a Hawaiian shirt than like a question. I don't know
about you, Mr. Jones, C.E.T., but it puts _me_ off.

>  
>> 9 times out of 10 if you just post the words its difficult to grasp
>> the meaning if its just plain /generic.
>
> If 90% of plain text is incomprehensible, I don't see how html can help.

I'll even venture that, in some cases, fancy presentation can make the text
_less_ understandable. I've seen it in my lawyer's emails: once she learnt to
send in plaintext, suddenly her emails became almost crystal-clear, where
before they had given me headaches just reading them (or trying to).

>
> followup set to m.general

Best regards,
Tony.
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Re: Newsgroup policy and HTML

PhillipJones
In reply to this post by »Q«
»Q« wrote:

> "Phillip M. Jones, C.E.T" <[hidden email]> wrote:
>
>> David E. Ross wrote:
>>
>>> From <http://www.dtek.chalmers.se/~d97jorn/pgp/killhtml.html>:
>>> "Parting with some of the capabilities of HTML, like the ability to
>>> insert animated graphics of smiling faces, might actually be quite
>>> beneficial for some.  Without them, they may just have to
>>> rediscover the art of writing in order to convey their thoughts."
>> I still don't see this knee jerk reaction to having even just the
>> ability to boldface/ underline or Italicize words/phrases/ paragraphs
>> to make a point.
>
> That ability need not be tied to all the bloat of html.  Simple
> pseudo-markup works:  *bold*, /italics/, _underline_.
>  
>> 9 times out of 10 if you just post the words its difficult to grasp
>> the meaning if its just plain /generic.
>
> If 90% of plain text is incomprehensible, I don't see how html can help.
>
> followup set to m.general

Well I've tried such commands here in Mozilla groups and they don't work

all you is your extra characters added.


*bold*, /italics/, _underline_.
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Re: Newsgroup policy and HTML

»Q«
"Phillip M. Jones, C.E.T" <[hidden email]> wrote:

> Well I've tried such commands here in Mozilla groups and they don't
> work
>
> all you is your extra characters added.
>
>
> *bold*, /italics/, _underline_

It's not a problem if your client doesn't alter its display because of
them, since you *know* that a word with asterisks around it is
being emphasized.
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Re: Newsgroup policy and HTML

PhillipJones
»Q« wrote:

> "Phillip M. Jones, C.E.T" <[hidden email]> wrote:
>
>> Well I've tried such commands here in Mozilla groups and they don't
>> work
>>
>> all you is your extra characters added.
>>
>>
>> *bold*, /italics/, _underline_
>
> It's not a problem if your client doesn't alter its display because of
> them, since you *know* that a word with asterisks around it is
> being emphasized.
But I am using SeaMonkey a Mozilla Product in fact FF/TB code is used in
SeaMonkey.

Thunderbird also doesn't read them as well

I have set to accept HTML

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Re: Newsgroup policy and HTML

Terry R.
In reply to this post by PhillipJones
On 10/18/2007 2:03 PM On a whim, Phillip M. Jones, C.E.T pounded out on
the keyboard

> »Q« wrote:
>> "Phillip M. Jones, C.E.T" <[hidden email]> wrote:
>>
>>> David E. Ross wrote:
>>>
>>>> From <http://www.dtek.chalmers.se/~d97jorn/pgp/killhtml.html>:
>>>> "Parting with some of the capabilities of HTML, like the ability to
>>>> insert animated graphics of smiling faces, might actually be quite
>>>> beneficial for some.  Without them, they may just have to
>>>> rediscover the art of writing in order to convey their thoughts."
>>> I still don't see this knee jerk reaction to having even just the
>>> ability to boldface/ underline or Italicize words/phrases/ paragraphs
>>> to make a point.
>> That ability need not be tied to all the bloat of html.  Simple
>> pseudo-markup works:  *bold*, /italics/, _underline_.
>>  
>>> 9 times out of 10 if you just post the words its difficult to grasp
>>> the meaning if its just plain /generic.
>> If 90% of plain text is incomprehensible, I don't see how html can help.
>>
>> followup set to m.general
>
> Well I've tried such commands here in Mozilla groups and they don't work
>
> all you is your extra characters added.
>
>
> *bold*, /italics/, _underline_.

The above displays properly.  I only see it tagged when I reply.

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Re: Newsgroup policy and HTML

Blinky the Shark
In reply to this post by PhillipJones
Phillip M. Jones, C.E.T wrote:
> »Q« wrote:

>> That ability need not be tied to all the bloat of html.  Simple
>> pseudo-markup works:  *bold*, /italics/, _underline_.
>>  
>>> 9 times out of 10 if you just post the words its difficult to grasp
>>> the meaning if its just plain /generic.
>> If 90% of plain text is incomprehensible, I don't see how html can help.
>>
>> followup set to m.general
>
> Well I've tried such commands here in Mozilla groups and they don't work
> all you is your extra characters added.

Pssst!  Phillip.  Look.

http://blinkynet.net/stuff/comp/styling_without_html.jpg


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Re: Newsgroup policy and HTML

Terry R.
In reply to this post by PhillipJones
On 10/18/2007 3:01 PM On a whim, Phillip M. Jones, C.E.T pounded out on
the keyboard

> »Q« wrote:
>> "Phillip M. Jones, C.E.T" <[hidden email]> wrote:
>>
>>> Well I've tried such commands here in Mozilla groups and they don't
>>> work
>>>
>>> all you is your extra characters added.
>>>
>>>
>>> *bold*, /italics/, _underline_
>> It's not a problem if your client doesn't alter its display because of
>> them, since you *know* that a word with asterisks around it is
>> being emphasized.
> But I am using SeaMonkey a Mozilla Product in fact FF/TB code is used in
> SeaMonkey.
>
> Thunderbird also doesn't read them as well
>
> I have set to accept HTML
>

Phillip,

In your browser, type about:config
Search for:  mail.display_struct
If it's set to false, change it to true


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Re: Newsgroup policy and HTML

Tony Mechelynck
In reply to this post by PhillipJones
Phillip M. Jones, C.E.T wrote:

> »Q« wrote:
>> "Phillip M. Jones, C.E.T" <[hidden email]> wrote:
>>
>>> David E. Ross wrote:
>>>
>>>> From <http://www.dtek.chalmers.se/~d97jorn/pgp/killhtml.html>:
>>>> "Parting with some of the capabilities of HTML, like the ability to
>>>> insert animated graphics of smiling faces, might actually be quite
>>>> beneficial for some.  Without them, they may just have to
>>>> rediscover the art of writing in order to convey their thoughts."
>>> I still don't see this knee jerk reaction to having even just the
>>> ability to boldface/ underline or Italicize words/phrases/ paragraphs
>>> to make a point.
>>
>> That ability need not be tied to all the bloat of html.  Simple
>> pseudo-markup works:  *bold*, /italics/, _underline_.
>>  
>>> 9 times out of 10 if you just post the words its difficult to grasp
>>> the meaning if its just plain /generic.
>>
>> If 90% of plain text is incomprehensible, I don't see how html can help.
>>
>> followup set to m.general
>
> Well I've tried such commands here in Mozilla groups and they don't work
>
> all you is your extra characters added.
>
>
> *bold*, /italics/, _underline_.

According to your headers, you're using Firefox 2.0.0.3 for the Mac. When
reading webmail via HTTP, how these appear depends on the goodwill of the
webmail server. If you were using Thunderbird (like I do), you would see them.


Best regards,
Tony.
--
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Bernie: "Nobody ever empties the ashtrays.  People are SO
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Re: Newsgroup policy and HTML

»Q«
In reply to this post by PhillipJones
"Phillip M. Jones, C.E.T" <[hidden email]> wrote:

> »Q« wrote:
> > "Phillip M. Jones, C.E.T" <[hidden email]> wrote:
> >  
> >> Well I've tried such commands here in Mozilla groups and they don't
> >> work
> >>
> >> all you is your extra characters added.
> >>
> >> *bold*, /italics/, _underline_  
> >
> > It's not a problem if your client doesn't alter its display because
> > of them, since you *know* that a word with asterisks around it is
> > being emphasized.
>
> But I am using SeaMonkey a Mozilla Product in fact FF/TB code is used
> in SeaMonkey.
>
> Thunderbird also doesn't read them as well

Any client can display *asterisks*.  The asterisks work to let you
know that a word is being emphasized, whether or not your client
displays the word in bold text.
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Re: Newsgroup policy and HTML

PhillipJones
In reply to this post by Terry R.
Terry R. wrote:

> On 10/18/2007 2:03 PM On a whim, Phillip M. Jones, C.E.T pounded out on
> the keyboard
>
>> »Q« wrote:
>>> "Phillip M. Jones, C.E.T" <[hidden email]> wrote:
>>>
>>>> David E. Ross wrote:
>>>>
>>>>> From <http://www.dtek.chalmers.se/~d97jorn/pgp/killhtml.html>:
>>>>> "Parting with some of the capabilities of HTML, like the ability to
>>>>> insert animated graphics of smiling faces, might actually be quite
>>>>> beneficial for some.  Without them, they may just have to
>>>>> rediscover the art of writing in order to convey their thoughts."
>>>> I still don't see this knee jerk reaction to having even just the
>>>> ability to boldface/ underline or Italicize words/phrases/ paragraphs
>>>> to make a point.
>>> That ability need not be tied to all the bloat of html.  Simple
>>> pseudo-markup works:  *bold*, /italics/, _underline_.
>>>  
>>>> 9 times out of 10 if you just post the words its difficult to grasp
>>>> the meaning if its just plain /generic.
>>> If 90% of plain text is incomprehensible, I don't see how html can help.
>>>
>>> followup set to m.general
>>
>> Well I've tried such commands here in Mozilla groups and they don't work
>>
>> all you is your extra characters added.
>>
>>
>> *bold*, /italics/, _underline_.
>
> The above displays properly.  I only see it tagged when I reply.
>
I don't see them regardless of how many layers deep in a reply. I've
tried an alternate Profile  no difference.

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If it's "fixed", don't "break it"!            mailto:[hidden email]
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Re: Newsgroup policy and HTML

PhillipJones
In reply to this post by Blinky the Shark
Blinky the Shark wrote:

> Phillip M. Jones, C.E.T wrote:
>> »Q« wrote:
>
>>> That ability need not be tied to all the bloat of html.  Simple
>>> pseudo-markup works:  *bold*, /italics/, _underline_.
>>>  
>>>> 9 times out of 10 if you just post the words its difficult to grasp
>>>> the meaning if its just plain /generic.
>>> If 90% of plain text is incomprehensible, I don't see how html can help.
>>>
>>> followup set to m.general
>>
>> Well I've tried such commands here in Mozilla groups and they don't work
>> all you is your extra characters added.
>
> Pssst!  Phillip.  Look.
>
> http://blinkynet.net/stuff/comp/styling_without_html.jpg
>
>
Well Why am I not seeing them.

--
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If it's "fixed", don't "break it"!            mailto:[hidden email]
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Re: Newsgroup policy and HTML

PhillipJones
Phillip M. Jones, C.E.T wrote:

> Blinky the Shark wrote:
>> Phillip M. Jones, C.E.T wrote:
>>> »Q« wrote:
>>
>>>> That ability need not be tied to all the bloat of html.  Simple
>>>> pseudo-markup works:  *bold*, /italics/, _underline_.
>>>>  
>>>>> 9 times out of 10 if you just post the words its difficult to grasp
>>>>> the meaning if its just plain /generic.
>>>> If 90% of plain text is incomprehensible, I don't see how html can
>>>> help.
>>>>
>>>> followup set to m.general
>>>
>>> Well I've tried such commands here in Mozilla groups and they don't work
>>> all you is your extra characters added.
>>
>> Pssst!  Phillip.  Look.
>>
>> http://blinkynet.net/stuff/comp/styling_without_html.jpg
>>
>>
> Well Why am I not seeing them.
>

*I* /am/ _trying out_ to see if works now.

--
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If it's "fixed", don't "break it"!            mailto:[hidden email]
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Re: Newsgroup policy and HTML

PhillipJones
Phillip M. Jones, C.E.T wrote:

> Phillip M. Jones, C.E.T wrote:
>> Blinky the Shark wrote:
>>> Phillip M. Jones, C.E.T wrote:
>>>> »Q« wrote:
>>>
>>>>> That ability need not be tied to all the bloat of html.  Simple
>>>>> pseudo-markup works:  *bold*, /italics/, _underline_.
>>>>>  
>>>>>> 9 times out of 10 if you just post the words its difficult to grasp
>>>>>> the meaning if its just plain /generic.
>>>>> If 90% of plain text is incomprehensible, I don't see how html can
>>>>> help.
>>>>>
>>>>> followup set to m.general
>>>>
>>>> Well I've tried such commands here in Mozilla groups and they don't
>>>> work
>>>> all you is your extra characters added.
>>>
>>> Pssst!  Phillip.  Look.
>>>
>>> http://blinkynet.net/stuff/comp/styling_without_html.jpg
>>>
>>>
>> Well Why am I not seeing them.
>>
>
> *I* /am/ _trying out_ to see if works now.
>
-lets see-

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Re: Newsgroup policy and HTML

Peter Potamus the Purple Hippo
In reply to this post by PhillipJones
Phillip M. Jones, C.E.T wrote:
>> Well Why am I not seeing them.
> *I* /am/ _trying out_ to see if works now.

its working at my end.  Don't you see them?

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Re: Newsgroup policy and HTML

PhillipJones
Peter Potamus the Purple Hippo wrote:
> Phillip M. Jones, C.E.T wrote:
>>> Well Why am I not seeing them.
>> *I* /am/ _trying out_ to see if works now.
>
> its working at my end.  Don't you see them?
>
_I_ can get all working now except underline

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Re: Newsgroup policy and HTML

PhillipJones
Phillip M. Jones, C.E.T wrote:
> Peter Potamus the Purple Hippo wrote:
>> Phillip M. Jones, C.E.T wrote:
>>>> Well Why am I not seeing them.
>>> *I* /am/ _trying out_ to see if works now.
>>
>> its working at my end.  Don't you see them?
>>
> _I_ can get all working now except underline
>
  lets try <->underline</->

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Re: Newsgroup policy and HTML

PhillipJones
Phillip M. Jones, C.E.T wrote:

> Phillip M. Jones, C.E.T wrote:
>> Peter Potamus the Purple Hippo wrote:
>>> Phillip M. Jones, C.E.T wrote:
>>>>> Well Why am I not seeing them.
>>>> *I* /am/ _trying out_ to see if works now.
>>>
>>> its working at my end.  Don't you see them?
>>>
>> _I_ can get all working now except underline
>>
>  lets try <->underline</->
>
  lets try –this–

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Re: Newsgroup policy and HTML

Peter Potamus the Purple Hippo
In reply to this post by PhillipJones
Phillip M. Jones, C.E.T wrote:
> Peter Potamus the Purple Hippo wrote:
>> Phillip M. Jones, C.E.T wrote:
>>>> Well Why am I not seeing them.
>>> *I* /am/ _trying out_ to see if works now.
>> its working at my end.  Don't you see them?
>>
> _I_ can get all working now except underline
>

well, like I said, its working from this end, so you're
doing something right.  Why you don't see them is another story

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Re: Newsgroup policy and HTML

PhillipJones
In reply to this post by PhillipJones
Phillip M. Jones, C.E.T wrote:

> Phillip M. Jones, C.E.T wrote:
>> Phillip M. Jones, C.E.T wrote:
>>> Peter Potamus the Purple Hippo wrote:
>>>> Phillip M. Jones, C.E.T wrote:
>>>>>> Well Why am I not seeing them.
>>>>> *I* /am/ _trying out_ to see if works now.
>>>>
>>>> its working at my end.  Don't you see them?
>>>>
>>> _I_ can get all working now except underline
>>>
>>  lets try <->underline</->
>>
>  lets try –this–
>

Nope can't get  underline to work. I use quote Colors and had this
feature turned off well at least I can get Bold face working. and italics.

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Phillip M. Jones, CET                                http://www.vpea.org
If it's "fixed", don't "break it"!            mailto:[hidden email]
                              http://www.kimbanet.com/~pjones/default.htm
Mac G4-500, OSX.3.9               Mac 17" PowerBook G4-1.67 Gb, OSX.4.10
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