OT -- Android 4.2.1 nastiness

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OT -- Android 4.2.1 nastiness

The Real Bev
Suddenly, although I have 1.2 GB available in my 'phone' partition and
90 MB available in my 'internal storage' partition, I'm told I don't
have enough space to update ANY of the 10 or so apps that attempted to
auto-update.  I deleted an app and was told I didn't have enough space
to even reinstall it.  A bit of searching reveals that this problem
exists for a number of different brands of phones, so I conclude it's an
Android glitch.

I did what the google website (about as inadequate for Android as it's
possible to be) suggested (clearing the data and cache for play store
and download manager) and spent at least half an hour on the phone with
some nice google ladies who were completely unable to help because they
really only knew about Nexus phones, not others.

I'm really shocked that google sells Android to other manufacturers but
has no OS-only help facility at all -- especially when there seem to be
OS-related problems that have nothing at all to do with the hardware
it's installed on.

Anyway, I'm using the scattergun approach to finding a solution.  I've
posted into some appropriate places and I've emailed BLU, but they
normally take a couple of days to respond and they'll probably tell me
to do a factory reset -- which will probably solve the problem, but is
clearly undesirable.

--
Cheers, Bev
++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++
"...so she told me it was either her or the ham radio, over."
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Re: OT -- Android 4.2.1 nastiness

responder-2
On 10/4/2014 7:13 PM, The Real Bev wrote:

> Suddenly, although I have 1.2 GB available in my 'phone' partition and
> 90 MB available in my 'internal storage' partition, I'm told I don't
> have enough space to update ANY of the 10 or so apps that attempted to
> auto-update.  I deleted an app and was told I didn't have enough space
> to even reinstall it.  A bit of searching reveals that this problem
> exists for a number of different brands of phones, so I conclude it's an
> Android glitch.
>
> I did what the google website (about as inadequate for Android as it's
> possible to be) suggested (clearing the data and cache for play store
> and download manager) and spent at least half an hour on the phone with
> some nice google ladies who were completely unable to help because they
> really only knew about Nexus phones, not others.
>
> I'm really shocked that google sells Android to other manufacturers but
> has no OS-only help facility at all -- especially when there seem to be
> OS-related problems that have nothing at all to do with the hardware
> it's installed on.
>
> Anyway, I'm using the scattergun approach to finding a solution.  I've
> posted into some appropriate places and I've emailed BLU, but they
> normally take a couple of days to respond and they'll probably tell me
> to do a factory reset -- which will probably solve the problem, but is
> clearly undesirable.
>

Join the crowd.

I have the same issues.

My current phone is about 8 mos old and I had to replace it about 2
months ago for some problem that persisted, The replacements are fine.

I had the original phones rooted and this solved the memory problem.
When they had to be replaced in warranty, since rooting voids that
warranty, I un-rooted them first,

Now, after experiencing the same situation as you, I'm getting ready to
root again.

Good luck..
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Re: OT -- Android 4.2.1 nastiness

The Real Bev
On 10/04/2014 06:27 PM, responder wrote:

> On 10/4/2014 7:13 PM, The Real Bev wrote:
>> Suddenly, although I have 1.2 GB available in my 'phone' partition and
>> 90 MB available in my 'internal storage' partition, I'm told I don't
>> have enough space to update ANY of the 10 or so apps that attempted to
>> auto-update.  I deleted an app and was told I didn't have enough space
>> to even reinstall it.  A bit of searching reveals that this problem
>> exists for a number of different brands of phones, so I conclude it's an
>> Android glitch.
>>
>> I did what the google website (about as inadequate for Android as it's
>> possible to be) suggested (clearing the data and cache for play store
>> and download manager) and spent at least half an hour on the phone with
>> some nice google ladies who were completely unable to help because they
>> really only knew about Nexus phones, not others.
>>
>> I'm really shocked that google sells Android to other manufacturers but
>> has no OS-only help facility at all -- especially when there seem to be
>> OS-related problems that have nothing at all to do with the hardware
>> it's installed on.
>>
>> Anyway, I'm using the scattergun approach to finding a solution.  I've
>> posted into some appropriate places and I've emailed BLU, but they
>> normally take a couple of days to respond and they'll probably tell me
>> to do a factory reset -- which will probably solve the problem, but is
>> clearly undesirable.
>
> Join the crowd.
>
> I have the same issues.
>
> My current phone is about 8 mos old and I had to replace it about 2
> months ago for some problem that persisted, The replacements are fine.
>
> I had the original phones rooted and this solved the memory problem.
> When they had to be replaced in warranty, since rooting voids that
> warranty, I un-rooted them first,
>
> Now, after experiencing the same situation as you, I'm getting ready to
> root again.
>
> Good luck..

I found a notification for updating Firefox NOT through the play store.
  It seemed to go perfectly, but I can't remember what the old version
number was.  It's now 32.0.  Is that the latest for Android?

If sideloading or going through other non-playstore sites works fine,
that would seem to narrow it down to a playstore problem, wouldn't it?

Except for the 4-GB internal memory problem (which I should have known
about, except it's not publicized by the manufacturers or the reviewers,
who just say the unit has an external sdcard slot and if you want to
believe that you can run apps from it, well, that's OK with them, it's
not THEIR job to educate you) I like the BLU phone.  When the camera was
bad (out of the box, no distant focus) they replaced it quickly and I
think they sent me a prepaid UPS label.  I'm going to phone them Monday
or Tuesday...

I've never seen anything about rooting this phone, so I'm not even going
to consider that.

--
Cheers, Bev
*----------------------------------------------------*
*Are you *sure* there's a hyphen in "anal-retentive?"*
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Re: OT -- Android 4.2.1 nastiness

The Real Bev
On 10/04/2014 11:02 PM, The Real Bev wrote:

> On 10/04/2014 06:27 PM, responder wrote:
>> On 10/4/2014 7:13 PM, The Real Bev wrote:
>>> Suddenly, although I have 1.2 GB available in my 'phone' partition and
>>> 90 MB available in my 'internal storage' partition, I'm told I don't
>>> have enough space to update ANY of the 10 or so apps that attempted to
>>> auto-update.  I deleted an app and was told I didn't have enough space
>>> to even reinstall it.  A bit of searching reveals that this problem
>>> exists for a number of different brands of phones, so I conclude it's an
>>> Android glitch.
>>>
>>> I did what the google website (about as inadequate for Android as it's
>>> possible to be) suggested (clearing the data and cache for play store
>>> and download manager) and spent at least half an hour on the phone with
>>> some nice google ladies who were completely unable to help because they
>>> really only knew about Nexus phones, not others.
>>>
>>> I'm really shocked that google sells Android to other manufacturers but
>>> has no OS-only help facility at all -- especially when there seem to be
>>> OS-related problems that have nothing at all to do with the hardware
>>> it's installed on.
>>>
>>> Anyway, I'm using the scattergun approach to finding a solution.  I've
>>> posted into some appropriate places and I've emailed BLU, but they
>>> normally take a couple of days to respond and they'll probably tell me
>>> to do a factory reset -- which will probably solve the problem, but is
>>> clearly undesirable.
>>
>> Join the crowd.
>>
>> I have the same issues.
>>
>> My current phone is about 8 mos old and I had to replace it about 2
>> months ago for some problem that persisted, The replacements are fine.
>>
>> I had the original phones rooted and this solved the memory problem.
>> When they had to be replaced in warranty, since rooting voids that
>> warranty, I un-rooted them first,
>>
>> Now, after experiencing the same situation as you, I'm getting ready to
>> root again.
>>
>> Good luck..
>
> I found a notification for updating Firefox NOT through the play store.
>    It seemed to go perfectly, but I can't remember what the old version
> number was.  It's now 32.0.  Is that the latest for Android?
>
> If sideloading or going through other non-playstore sites works fine,
> that would seem to narrow it down to a playstore problem, wouldn't it?
>
> Except for the 4-GB internal memory problem (which I should have known
> about, except it's not publicized by the manufacturers or the reviewers,
> who just say the unit has an external sdcard slot and if you want to
> believe that you can run apps from it, well, that's OK with them, it's
> not THEIR job to educate you) I like the BLU phone.  When the camera was
> bad (out of the box, no distant focus) they replaced it quickly and I
> think they sent me a prepaid UPS label.  I'm going to phone them Monday
> or Tuesday...
>
> I've never seen anything about rooting this phone, so I'm not even going
> to consider that.

Addendum:  It's definitely the play store -- I just downloaded the TED
.apk file, copied it to my external sd card and installed it from there.
  No problem.  Google seems to be if not actually evil a little less
good than it claims to be.

Find the URL for the app you want to download -- or maybe even update, I
haven't tried that yet -- and feed it into this website:
http://apps.evozi.com , If you're running chrome you can get an
extension to do it and save a step.  So far so good...


--
Cheers, Bev
*----------------------------------------------------*
*Are you *sure* there's a hyphen in "anal-retentive?"*
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Re: OT -- Android 4.2.1 nastiness

Ron Hunter
On 10/5/2014 1:19 AM, The Real Bev wrote:

> On 10/04/2014 11:02 PM, The Real Bev wrote:
>> On 10/04/2014 06:27 PM, responder wrote:
>>> On 10/4/2014 7:13 PM, The Real Bev wrote:
>>>> Suddenly, although I have 1.2 GB available in my 'phone' partition and
>>>> 90 MB available in my 'internal storage' partition, I'm told I don't
>>>> have enough space to update ANY of the 10 or so apps that attempted to
>>>> auto-update.  I deleted an app and was told I didn't have enough space
>>>> to even reinstall it.  A bit of searching reveals that this problem
>>>> exists for a number of different brands of phones, so I conclude
>>>> it's an
>>>> Android glitch.
>>>>
>>>> I did what the google website (about as inadequate for Android as it's
>>>> possible to be) suggested (clearing the data and cache for play store
>>>> and download manager) and spent at least half an hour on the phone with
>>>> some nice google ladies who were completely unable to help because they
>>>> really only knew about Nexus phones, not others.
>>>>
>>>> I'm really shocked that google sells Android to other manufacturers but
>>>> has no OS-only help facility at all -- especially when there seem to be
>>>> OS-related problems that have nothing at all to do with the hardware
>>>> it's installed on.
>>>>
>>>> Anyway, I'm using the scattergun approach to finding a solution.  I've
>>>> posted into some appropriate places and I've emailed BLU, but they
>>>> normally take a couple of days to respond and they'll probably tell me
>>>> to do a factory reset -- which will probably solve the problem, but is
>>>> clearly undesirable.
>>>
>>> Join the crowd.
>>>
>>> I have the same issues.
>>>
>>> My current phone is about 8 mos old and I had to replace it about 2
>>> months ago for some problem that persisted, The replacements are fine.
>>>
>>> I had the original phones rooted and this solved the memory problem.
>>> When they had to be replaced in warranty, since rooting voids that
>>> warranty, I un-rooted them first,
>>>
>>> Now, after experiencing the same situation as you, I'm getting ready to
>>> root again.
>>>
>>> Good luck..
>>
>> I found a notification for updating Firefox NOT through the play store.
>>    It seemed to go perfectly, but I can't remember what the old version
>> number was.  It's now 32.0.  Is that the latest for Android?
>>
>> If sideloading or going through other non-playstore sites works fine,
>> that would seem to narrow it down to a playstore problem, wouldn't it?
>>
>> Except for the 4-GB internal memory problem (which I should have known
>> about, except it's not publicized by the manufacturers or the reviewers,
>> who just say the unit has an external sdcard slot and if you want to
>> believe that you can run apps from it, well, that's OK with them, it's
>> not THEIR job to educate you) I like the BLU phone.  When the camera was
>> bad (out of the box, no distant focus) they replaced it quickly and I
>> think they sent me a prepaid UPS label.  I'm going to phone them Monday
>> or Tuesday...
>>
>> I've never seen anything about rooting this phone, so I'm not even going
>> to consider that.
>
> Addendum:  It's definitely the play store -- I just downloaded the TED
> .apk file, copied it to my external sd card and installed it from there.
>   No problem.  Google seems to be if not actually evil a little less
> good than it claims to be.
>
> Find the URL for the app you want to download -- or maybe even update, I
> haven't tried that yet -- and feed it into this website:
> http://apps.evozi.com , If you're running chrome you can get an
> extension to do it and save a step.  So far so good...
>
>
One of the things Android phone/tablet users brag about (endlessly) is
that their phones/tablets can expand memory by plugging in an SD card.
Trouble is, the phone/tablet won't USE that memory for anything but
'external storage'.  You can't install some apps there, and you can't
use it for 'system work space'.  In the end, you have a lot of memory,
you can't just use.  At least on my iPhone, the free memory can always
be used, and I don't have to go and delete apps in order to update other
apps.  There are some ugly 'features' that are hidden behind the hype,
in both OSs, but I have come to really dislike the Android (4.1) OS.

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Re: OT -- Android 4.2.1 nastiness

The Real Bev
On 10/05/2014 01:36 AM, Ron Hunter wrote:

> On 10/5/2014 1:19 AM, The Real Bev wrote:
>> On 10/04/2014 11:02 PM, The Real Bev wrote:
>>> On 10/04/2014 06:27 PM, responder wrote:
>>>> On 10/4/2014 7:13 PM, The Real Bev wrote:
>>>>> Suddenly, although I have 1.2 GB available in my 'phone' partition and
>>>>> 90 MB available in my 'internal storage' partition, I'm told I don't
>>>>> have enough space to update ANY of the 10 or so apps that attempted to
>>>>> auto-update.  I deleted an app and was told I didn't have enough space
>>>>> to even reinstall it.  A bit of searching reveals that this problem
>>>>> exists for a number of different brands of phones, so I conclude
>>>>> it's an
>>>>> Android glitch.
>>>>>
>>>>> I did what the google website (about as inadequate for Android as it's
>>>>> possible to be) suggested (clearing the data and cache for play store
>>>>> and download manager) and spent at least half an hour on the phone with
>>>>> some nice google ladies who were completely unable to help because they
>>>>> really only knew about Nexus phones, not others.
>>>>>
>>>>> I'm really shocked that google sells Android to other manufacturers but
>>>>> has no OS-only help facility at all -- especially when there seem to be
>>>>> OS-related problems that have nothing at all to do with the hardware
>>>>> it's installed on.
>>>>>
>>>>> Anyway, I'm using the scattergun approach to finding a solution.  I've
>>>>> posted into some appropriate places and I've emailed BLU, but they
>>>>> normally take a couple of days to respond and they'll probably tell me
>>>>> to do a factory reset -- which will probably solve the problem, but is
>>>>> clearly undesirable.
>>>>
>>>> Join the crowd.
>>>>
>>>> I have the same issues.
>>>>
>>>> My current phone is about 8 mos old and I had to replace it about 2
>>>> months ago for some problem that persisted, The replacements are fine.
>>>>
>>>> I had the original phones rooted and this solved the memory problem.
>>>> When they had to be replaced in warranty, since rooting voids that
>>>> warranty, I un-rooted them first,
>>>>
>>>> Now, after experiencing the same situation as you, I'm getting ready to
>>>> root again.
>>>>
>>>> Good luck..
>>>
>>> I found a notification for updating Firefox NOT through the play store.
>>>    It seemed to go perfectly, but I can't remember what the old version
>>> number was.  It's now 32.0.  Is that the latest for Android?
>>>
>>> If sideloading or going through other non-playstore sites works fine,
>>> that would seem to narrow it down to a playstore problem, wouldn't it?
>>>
>>> Except for the 4-GB internal memory problem (which I should have known
>>> about, except it's not publicized by the manufacturers or the reviewers,
>>> who just say the unit has an external sdcard slot and if you want to
>>> believe that you can run apps from it, well, that's OK with them, it's
>>> not THEIR job to educate you) I like the BLU phone.  When the camera was
>>> bad (out of the box, no distant focus) they replaced it quickly and I
>>> think they sent me a prepaid UPS label.  I'm going to phone them Monday
>>> or Tuesday...
>>>
>>> I've never seen anything about rooting this phone, so I'm not even going
>>> to consider that.
>>
>> Addendum:  It's definitely the play store -- I just downloaded the TED
>> .apk file, copied it to my external sd card and installed it from there.
>>   No problem.  Google seems to be if not actually evil a little less
>> good than it claims to be.
>>
>> Find the URL for the app you want to download -- or maybe even update, I
>> haven't tried that yet -- and feed it into this website:
>> http://apps.evozi.com , If you're running chrome you can get an
>> extension to do it and save a step.  So far so good...
>>
>>
> One of the things Android phone/tablet users brag about (endlessly) is
> that their phones/tablets can expand memory by plugging in an SD card.
> Trouble is, the phone/tablet won't USE that memory for anything but
> 'external storage'.  You can't install some apps there, and you can't
> use it for 'system work space'.  In the end, you have a lot of memory,
> you can't just use.

Exactly right.  I can only conclude that the manufacturers and reviewers
refrain from mentioning this little detriment for obvious reasons.  A
number of people in the android newsgroup were as shocked as I was to
find out that 4GB of internal memory is all that you can actually use.

That being said, I searched the entire device for TED and found only the
file on my external card.  Either it's actually running from the card
(apparently this is something that the writers of apps can control,
which makes me wonder why they don't ALL do this) or it installed into
some area I can't see.  I've found various installed files for other
apps before, so perhaps the TED guy did something extraordinary.

Osmand and Co-Pilot can store their maps on the external card;  osmand
gives you this choice within the UI, but Co-Pilot requires that you edit
an .ini-type file, the instructions for which I found on line SOMEWHERE.

> At least on my iPhone, the free memory can always
> be used, and I don't have to go and delete apps in order to update other
> apps.  There are some ugly 'features' that are hidden behind the hype,
> in both OSs, but I have come to really dislike the Android (4.1) OS.

If I'd known I probably would have bought something with maybe 32 gb of
internal memory, but maybe not -- they're too expensive.

BLU makes a phone with more internal memory AND a slot for a card.  If
BLU figures this is a warranty problem (warranty is almost up) maybe I
can swap this phone for the better one by paying the difference.  Or not.

What gripes me is that I've got something like $45 in credit at the
google play store which I don't think I can access by sideloading.  I've
only found a few apps I was willing to pay for, but still...

--
Cheers, Bev
=====================================================================
A: Because it messes up the order in which people normally read text.
Q: Why is it such a bad thing?
A: Top-posting.
Q: What is the most annoying thing on usenet?

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Re: OT -- Android 4.2.1 nastiness

F1Com
In reply to this post by Ron Hunter
On 10/5/2014 1:36 AM On a whim, Ron Hunter pounded out on the keyboard

> On 10/5/2014 1:19 AM, The Real Bev wrote:
>> On 10/04/2014 11:02 PM, The Real Bev wrote:
>>> On 10/04/2014 06:27 PM, responder wrote:
>>>> On 10/4/2014 7:13 PM, The Real Bev wrote:
>>>>> Suddenly, although I have 1.2 GB available in my 'phone' partition and
>>>>> 90 MB available in my 'internal storage' partition, I'm told I don't
>>>>> have enough space to update ANY of the 10 or so apps that attempted to
>>>>> auto-update.  I deleted an app and was told I didn't have enough space
>>>>> to even reinstall it.  A bit of searching reveals that this problem
>>>>> exists for a number of different brands of phones, so I conclude
>>>>> it's an
>>>>> Android glitch.
>>>>>
>>>>> I did what the google website (about as inadequate for Android as it's
>>>>> possible to be) suggested (clearing the data and cache for play store
>>>>> and download manager) and spent at least half an hour on the phone with
>>>>> some nice google ladies who were completely unable to help because they
>>>>> really only knew about Nexus phones, not others.
>>>>>
>>>>> I'm really shocked that google sells Android to other manufacturers but
>>>>> has no OS-only help facility at all -- especially when there seem to be
>>>>> OS-related problems that have nothing at all to do with the hardware
>>>>> it's installed on.
>>>>>
>>>>> Anyway, I'm using the scattergun approach to finding a solution.  I've
>>>>> posted into some appropriate places and I've emailed BLU, but they
>>>>> normally take a couple of days to respond and they'll probably tell me
>>>>> to do a factory reset -- which will probably solve the problem, but is
>>>>> clearly undesirable.
>>>> Join the crowd.
>>>>
>>>> I have the same issues.
>>>>
>>>> My current phone is about 8 mos old and I had to replace it about 2
>>>> months ago for some problem that persisted, The replacements are fine.
>>>>
>>>> I had the original phones rooted and this solved the memory problem.
>>>> When they had to be replaced in warranty, since rooting voids that
>>>> warranty, I un-rooted them first,
>>>>
>>>> Now, after experiencing the same situation as you, I'm getting ready to
>>>> root again.
>>>>
>>>> Good luck..
>>> I found a notification for updating Firefox NOT through the play store.
>>>     It seemed to go perfectly, but I can't remember what the old version
>>> number was.  It's now 32.0.  Is that the latest for Android?
>>>
>>> If sideloading or going through other non-playstore sites works fine,
>>> that would seem to narrow it down to a playstore problem, wouldn't it?
>>>
>>> Except for the 4-GB internal memory problem (which I should have known
>>> about, except it's not publicized by the manufacturers or the reviewers,
>>> who just say the unit has an external sdcard slot and if you want to
>>> believe that you can run apps from it, well, that's OK with them, it's
>>> not THEIR job to educate you) I like the BLU phone.  When the camera was
>>> bad (out of the box, no distant focus) they replaced it quickly and I
>>> think they sent me a prepaid UPS label.  I'm going to phone them Monday
>>> or Tuesday...
>>>
>>> I've never seen anything about rooting this phone, so I'm not even going
>>> to consider that.
>> Addendum:  It's definitely the play store -- I just downloaded the TED
>> .apk file, copied it to my external sd card and installed it from there.
>>    No problem.  Google seems to be if not actually evil a little less
>> good than it claims to be.
>>
>> Find the URL for the app you want to download -- or maybe even update, I
>> haven't tried that yet -- and feed it into this website:
>> http://apps.evozi.com , If you're running chrome you can get an
>> extension to do it and save a step.  So far so good...
>>
>>
> One of the things Android phone/tablet users brag about (endlessly) is
> that their phones/tablets can expand memory by plugging in an SD card.
> Trouble is, the phone/tablet won't USE that memory for anything but
> 'external storage'.  You can't install some apps there, and you can't
> use it for 'system work space'.  In the end, you have a lot of memory,
> you can't just use.  At least on my iPhone, the free memory can always
> be used, and I don't have to go and delete apps in order to update other
> apps.  There are some ugly 'features' that are hidden behind the hype,
> in both OSs, but I have come to really dislike the Android (4.1) OS.
>

Shows you don't know what you're talking about. I move apps to my wife's
SD card whenever needed.  Just because you can't update your tablet
beyond 4.1 to utilize the changes since then is your problem, not to
most other users.




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Re: OT -- Android 4.2.1 nastiness

F1Com
In reply to this post by The Real Bev
On 10/5/2014 10:36 AM On a whim, The Real Bev pounded out on the keyboard

> On 10/05/2014 01:36 AM, Ron Hunter wrote:
>> On 10/5/2014 1:19 AM, The Real Bev wrote:
>>> On 10/04/2014 11:02 PM, The Real Bev wrote:
>>>> On 10/04/2014 06:27 PM, responder wrote:
>>>>> On 10/4/2014 7:13 PM, The Real Bev wrote:
>>>>>> Suddenly, although I have 1.2 GB available in my 'phone' partition and
>>>>>> 90 MB available in my 'internal storage' partition, I'm told I don't
>>>>>> have enough space to update ANY of the 10 or so apps that attempted to
>>>>>> auto-update.  I deleted an app and was told I didn't have enough space
>>>>>> to even reinstall it.  A bit of searching reveals that this problem
>>>>>> exists for a number of different brands of phones, so I conclude
>>>>>> it's an
>>>>>> Android glitch.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> I did what the google website (about as inadequate for Android as it's
>>>>>> possible to be) suggested (clearing the data and cache for play store
>>>>>> and download manager) and spent at least half an hour on the phone with
>>>>>> some nice google ladies who were completely unable to help because they
>>>>>> really only knew about Nexus phones, not others.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> I'm really shocked that google sells Android to other manufacturers but
>>>>>> has no OS-only help facility at all -- especially when there seem to be
>>>>>> OS-related problems that have nothing at all to do with the hardware
>>>>>> it's installed on.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Anyway, I'm using the scattergun approach to finding a solution.  I've
>>>>>> posted into some appropriate places and I've emailed BLU, but they
>>>>>> normally take a couple of days to respond and they'll probably tell me
>>>>>> to do a factory reset -- which will probably solve the problem, but is
>>>>>> clearly undesirable.
>>>>> Join the crowd.
>>>>>
>>>>> I have the same issues.
>>>>>
>>>>> My current phone is about 8 mos old and I had to replace it about 2
>>>>> months ago for some problem that persisted, The replacements are fine.
>>>>>
>>>>> I had the original phones rooted and this solved the memory problem.
>>>>> When they had to be replaced in warranty, since rooting voids that
>>>>> warranty, I un-rooted them first,
>>>>>
>>>>> Now, after experiencing the same situation as you, I'm getting ready to
>>>>> root again.
>>>>>
>>>>> Good luck..
>>>> I found a notification for updating Firefox NOT through the play store.
>>>>     It seemed to go perfectly, but I can't remember what the old version
>>>> number was.  It's now 32.0.  Is that the latest for Android?
>>>>
>>>> If sideloading or going through other non-playstore sites works fine,
>>>> that would seem to narrow it down to a playstore problem, wouldn't it?
>>>>
>>>> Except for the 4-GB internal memory problem (which I should have known
>>>> about, except it's not publicized by the manufacturers or the reviewers,
>>>> who just say the unit has an external sdcard slot and if you want to
>>>> believe that you can run apps from it, well, that's OK with them, it's
>>>> not THEIR job to educate you) I like the BLU phone.  When the camera was
>>>> bad (out of the box, no distant focus) they replaced it quickly and I
>>>> think they sent me a prepaid UPS label.  I'm going to phone them Monday
>>>> or Tuesday...
>>>>
>>>> I've never seen anything about rooting this phone, so I'm not even going
>>>> to consider that.
>>> Addendum:  It's definitely the play store -- I just downloaded the TED
>>> .apk file, copied it to my external sd card and installed it from there.
>>>    No problem.  Google seems to be if not actually evil a little less
>>> good than it claims to be.
>>>
>>> Find the URL for the app you want to download -- or maybe even update, I
>>> haven't tried that yet -- and feed it into this website:
>>> http://apps.evozi.com , If you're running chrome you can get an
>>> extension to do it and save a step.  So far so good...
>>>
>>>
>> One of the things Android phone/tablet users brag about (endlessly) is
>> that their phones/tablets can expand memory by plugging in an SD card.
>> Trouble is, the phone/tablet won't USE that memory for anything but
>> 'external storage'.  You can't install some apps there, and you can't
>> use it for 'system work space'.  In the end, you have a lot of memory,
>> you can't just use.
>
> Exactly right.  I can only conclude that the manufacturers and reviewers
> refrain from mentioning this little detriment for obvious reasons.  A
> number of people in the android newsgroup were as shocked as I was to
> find out that 4GB of internal memory is all that you can actually use.
>
> That being said, I searched the entire device for TED and found only the
> file on my external card.  Either it's actually running from the card
> (apparently this is something that the writers of apps can control,
> which makes me wonder why they don't ALL do this) or it installed into
> some area I can't see.  I've found various installed files for other
> apps before, so perhaps the TED guy did something extraordinary.
>
> Osmand and Co-Pilot can store their maps on the external card;  osmand
> gives you this choice within the UI, but Co-Pilot requires that you edit
> an .ini-type file, the instructions for which I found on line SOMEWHERE.
>
>> At least on my iPhone, the free memory can always
>> be used, and I don't have to go and delete apps in order to update other
>> apps.  There are some ugly 'features' that are hidden behind the hype,
>> in both OSs, but I have come to really dislike the Android (4.1) OS.
>
> If I'd known I probably would have bought something with maybe 32 gb of
> internal memory, but maybe not -- they're too expensive.
>
> BLU makes a phone with more internal memory AND a slot for a card.  If
> BLU figures this is a warranty problem (warranty is almost up) maybe I
> can swap this phone for the better one by paying the difference.  Or not.
>
> What gripes me is that I've got something like $45 in credit at the
> google play store which I don't think I can access by sideloading.  I've
> only found a few apps I was willing to pay for, but still...
>

Maybe you too have an Android 4.1 device like Ron?  Since 4.2, this has
been possible.
https://play.google.com/store/apps/details?id=com.a0soft.gphone.app2sd&hl=en

And there is a simple way to force move apps for those that choose to.
http://techgage.com/article/moving_your_non-movable_android_apps_to_an_sd_card/




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Re: OT -- Android 4.2.1 nastiness

The Real Bev
On 10/09/2014 03:31 PM, [hidden email] wrote:

> On 10/5/2014 10:36 AM On a whim, The Real Bev pounded out on the
> keyboard
>
>> On 10/05/2014 01:36 AM, Ron Hunter wrote:
>>> On 10/5/2014 1:19 AM, The Real Bev wrote:
>>>> On 10/04/2014 11:02 PM, The Real Bev wrote:
>>>>> On 10/04/2014 06:27 PM, responder wrote:
>>>>>> On 10/4/2014 7:13 PM, The Real Bev wrote:
>>>>>>> Suddenly, although I have 1.2 GB available in my 'phone'
>>>>>>>  partition and 90 MB available in my 'internal storage'
>>>>>>> partition, I'm told I don't have enough space to update
>>>>>>> ANY of the 10 or so apps that attempted to auto-update.
>>>>>>> I deleted an app and was told I didn't have enough space
>>>>>>> to even reinstall it.  A bit of searching reveals that
>>>>>>> this problem exists for a number of different brands of
>>>>>>> phones, so I conclude it's an Android glitch.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> I did what the google website (about as inadequate for
>>>>>>> Android as it's possible to be) suggested (clearing the
>>>>>>> data and cache for play store and download manager) and
>>>>>>> spent at least half an hour on the phone with some nice
>>>>>>> google ladies who were completely unable to help because
>>>>>>>  they really only knew about Nexus phones, not others.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> I'm really shocked that google sells Android to other
>>>>>>> manufacturers but has no OS-only help facility at all --
>>>>>>>  especially when there seem to be OS-related problems
>>>>>>> that have nothing at all to do with the hardware it's
>>>>>>> installed on.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> Anyway, I'm using the scattergun approach to finding a
>>>>>>> solution.  I've posted into some appropriate places and
>>>>>>> I've emailed BLU, but they normally take a couple of days
>>>>>>> to respond and they'll probably tell me to do a factory
>>>>>>> reset -- which will probably solve the problem, but is
>>>>>>> clearly undesirable.
>>>>>> Join the crowd.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> I have the same issues.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> My current phone is about 8 mos old and I had to replace it
>>>>>> about 2 months ago for some problem that persisted, The
>>>>>> replacements are fine.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> I had the original phones rooted and this solved the memory
>>>>>> problem. When they had to be replaced in warranty, since
>>>>>> rooting voids that warranty, I un-rooted them first,
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Now, after experiencing the same situation as you, I'm
>>>>>> getting ready to root again.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Good luck..
>>>>> I found a notification for updating Firefox NOT through the
>>>>> play store. It seemed to go perfectly, but I can't remember
>>>>> what the old version number was.  It's now 32.0.  Is that the
>>>>> latest for Android?
>>>>>
>>>>> If sideloading or going through other non-playstore sites
>>>>> works fine, that would seem to narrow it down to a playstore
>>>>>  problem, wouldn't it?
>>>>>
>>>>> Except for the 4-GB internal memory problem (which I should
>>>>> have known about, except it's not publicized by the
>>>>> manufacturers or the reviewers, who just say the unit has an
>>>>>  external sdcard slot and if you want to believe that you can
>>>>>  run apps from it, well, that's OK with them, it's not THEIR
>>>>>  job to educate you) I like the BLU phone.  When the camera
>>>>> was bad (out of the box, no distant focus) they replaced it
>>>>> quickly and I think they sent me a prepaid UPS label.  I'm
>>>>> going to phone them Monday or Tuesday...
>>>>>
>>>>> I've never seen anything about rooting this phone, so I'm not
>>>>> even going to consider that.
>>>> Addendum:  It's definitely the play store -- I just downloaded
>>>>  the TED .apk file, copied it to my external sd card and
>>>> installed it from there. No problem.  Google seems to be if not
>>>> actually evil a little less good than it claims to be.
>>>>
>>>> Find the URL for the app you want to download -- or maybe even
>>>>  update, I haven't tried that yet -- and feed it into this
>>>> website: http://apps.evozi.com , If you're running chrome you
>>>> can get an extension to do it and save a step.  So far so
>>>> good...

I've been able to update using sideloading.  WOO-HOO.  Sort of.

>>> One of the things Android phone/tablet users brag about
>>> (endlessly) is that their phones/tablets can expand memory by
>>> plugging in an SD card. Trouble is, the phone/tablet won't USE
>>> that memory for anything but 'external storage'.  You can't
>>> install some apps there, and you can't use it for 'system work
>>> space'.  In the end, you have a lot of memory, you can't just
>>> use.
>>
>> Exactly right.  I can only conclude that the manufacturers and
>> reviewers refrain from mentioning this little detriment for obvious
>> reasons.  A number of people in the android newsgroup were as
>> shocked as I was to find out that 4GB of internal memory is all
>> that you can actually use.
>>
>> That being said, I searched the entire device for TED and found
>> only the file on my external card.  Either it's actually running
>> from the card (apparently this is something that the writers of
>> apps can control, which makes me wonder why they don't ALL do this)
>> or it installed into some area I can't see.  I've found various
>> installed files for other apps before, so perhaps the TED guy did
>> something extraordinary.
>>
>> Osmand and Co-Pilot can store their maps on the external card;
>> osmand gives you this choice within the UI, but Co-Pilot requires
>> that you edit an .ini-type file, the instructions for which I found
>> on line SOMEWHERE.

It's no longer there, but I have a 405K pdf file which I'll be happy to
email to anyone who wants it.

>>> At least on my iPhone, the free memory can always be used, and I
>>>  don't have to go and delete apps in order to update other apps.
>>>  There are some ugly 'features' that are hidden behind the hype,
>>>  in both OSs, but I have come to really dislike the Android (4.1)
>>>  OS.
>>
>> If I'd known I probably would have bought something with maybe 32
>> gb of internal memory, but maybe not -- they're too expensive.
>>
>> BLU makes a phone with more internal memory AND a slot for a card.
>>  If BLU figures this is a warranty problem (warranty is almost up)
>>  maybe I can swap this phone for the better one by paying the
>> difference.  Or not.

Nope.  They just say I should do a factory reset.

>> What gripes me is that I've got something like $45 in credit at
>> the google play store which I don't think I can access by
>> sideloading. I've only found a few apps I was willing to pay for,
>> but still...
>
> Maybe you too have an Android 4.1 device like Ron?  Since 4.2, this
> has been possible.
> https://play.google.com/store/apps/details?id=com.a0soft.gphone.app2sd&hl=en
>
>And there is a simple way to force move apps for those that choose
> to.
> http://techgage.com/article/moving_your_non-movable_android_apps_to_an_sd_card/

4.2.1.

I tried the first.  I've saved the second, but (a) I have to become
familiar enough with windows to do what needs to be done; and (b) I
suspect that that will have the same limitation as the first.

My phone refers to internal memory as "sdcard".  It has less space
available than what's called "phone" and is far more critical regarding
an acceptable level of free space.  If the 'sdcard' falls below ~70 MB
(out of 1 GB) I'm notified that I don't have enough space to do stuff
(like download email, for instance) even though I still have over 1 GB
of space in the
"phone" area.

Accordingly, the ability to move stuff to the 'sdcard' is useless;  the
damn thing is nearly full and I've moved as much as possible to the
'phone' area.  I would really like to be able to sort the apps by phone
or sdcard location so I wouldn't have to trial-and-error the process
when I need more 'sdcard' space.

Perhaps the second place will tell me how to substitute /sdcard1 for
sdcard, in which case it might be useful;  just moving
otherwise-immobile apps to the 'sdcard' is useless.

My current problem is that the Play Store has become unusable.  In every
instance it tells me there is not enough space to install or update an
app, even though I deleted FIVE apps in order to free up enough space.
I can download an app to my computer using
http://apps.evozi.com/apk-downloader/?id=com.ted.android (which for some
reason now wants Chrome instead of Firefox) or
http://market.1mobile.com/?from=new_version and sideload it to my phone
with no space problem whatsoever.

I can't fix the play store app(s).  I have emailed both BLU and google
asking them to email me the .apk files necessary to do this.  Otherwise
I will have to do a backup and factory reset, a process which is highly
undesirable due to the fact that I have to add in all the passwords and
personalizations by hand.  Yes, I've done that.  I hated it.

The reason I'm even considering it is that there are a number of pay
apps I'd like to have (co-pilot voice direction, for one) that I have
$45 worth of credit for.  I'm hoping that BLU and google come through
with a fix.

--
Cheers, Bev
------------------------------------------------------------------------
"I would be most content if my children grew up to be the kind of people
  who think decorating consists mostly of building enough bookshelves."
                                                        -- Anna Quindlen
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Re: OT -- Android 4.2.1 nastiness

Ron Hunter
On 10/13/2014 3:48 PM, The Real Bev wrote:

> On 10/09/2014 03:31 PM, [hidden email] wrote:
>> On 10/5/2014 10:36 AM On a whim, The Real Bev pounded out on the
>> keyboard
>>
>>> On 10/05/2014 01:36 AM, Ron Hunter wrote:
>>>> On 10/5/2014 1:19 AM, The Real Bev wrote:
>>>>> On 10/04/2014 11:02 PM, The Real Bev wrote:
>>>>>> On 10/04/2014 06:27 PM, responder wrote:
>>>>>>> On 10/4/2014 7:13 PM, The Real Bev wrote:
>>>>>>>> Suddenly, although I have 1.2 GB available in my 'phone'
>>>>>>>>  partition and 90 MB available in my 'internal storage'
>>>>>>>> partition, I'm told I don't have enough space to update
>>>>>>>> ANY of the 10 or so apps that attempted to auto-update.
>>>>>>>> I deleted an app and was told I didn't have enough space
>>>>>>>> to even reinstall it.  A bit of searching reveals that
>>>>>>>> this problem exists for a number of different brands of
>>>>>>>> phones, so I conclude it's an Android glitch.
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> I did what the google website (about as inadequate for
>>>>>>>> Android as it's possible to be) suggested (clearing the
>>>>>>>> data and cache for play store and download manager) and
>>>>>>>> spent at least half an hour on the phone with some nice
>>>>>>>> google ladies who were completely unable to help because
>>>>>>>>  they really only knew about Nexus phones, not others.
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> I'm really shocked that google sells Android to other
>>>>>>>> manufacturers but has no OS-only help facility at all --
>>>>>>>>  especially when there seem to be OS-related problems
>>>>>>>> that have nothing at all to do with the hardware it's
>>>>>>>> installed on.
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> Anyway, I'm using the scattergun approach to finding a
>>>>>>>> solution.  I've posted into some appropriate places and
>>>>>>>> I've emailed BLU, but they normally take a couple of days
>>>>>>>> to respond and they'll probably tell me to do a factory
>>>>>>>> reset -- which will probably solve the problem, but is
>>>>>>>> clearly undesirable.
>>>>>>> Join the crowd.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> I have the same issues.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> My current phone is about 8 mos old and I had to replace it
>>>>>>> about 2 months ago for some problem that persisted, The
>>>>>>> replacements are fine.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> I had the original phones rooted and this solved the memory
>>>>>>> problem. When they had to be replaced in warranty, since
>>>>>>> rooting voids that warranty, I un-rooted them first,
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> Now, after experiencing the same situation as you, I'm
>>>>>>> getting ready to root again.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> Good luck..
>>>>>> I found a notification for updating Firefox NOT through the
>>>>>> play store. It seemed to go perfectly, but I can't remember
>>>>>> what the old version number was.  It's now 32.0.  Is that the
>>>>>> latest for Android?
>>>>>>
>>>>>> If sideloading or going through other non-playstore sites
>>>>>> works fine, that would seem to narrow it down to a playstore
>>>>>>  problem, wouldn't it?
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Except for the 4-GB internal memory problem (which I should
>>>>>> have known about, except it's not publicized by the
>>>>>> manufacturers or the reviewers, who just say the unit has an
>>>>>>  external sdcard slot and if you want to believe that you can
>>>>>>  run apps from it, well, that's OK with them, it's not THEIR
>>>>>>  job to educate you) I like the BLU phone.  When the camera
>>>>>> was bad (out of the box, no distant focus) they replaced it
>>>>>> quickly and I think they sent me a prepaid UPS label.  I'm
>>>>>> going to phone them Monday or Tuesday...
>>>>>>
>>>>>> I've never seen anything about rooting this phone, so I'm not
>>>>>> even going to consider that.
>>>>> Addendum:  It's definitely the play store -- I just downloaded
>>>>>  the TED .apk file, copied it to my external sd card and
>>>>> installed it from there. No problem.  Google seems to be if not
>>>>> actually evil a little less good than it claims to be.
>>>>>
>>>>> Find the URL for the app you want to download -- or maybe even
>>>>>  update, I haven't tried that yet -- and feed it into this
>>>>> website: http://apps.evozi.com , If you're running chrome you
>>>>> can get an extension to do it and save a step.  So far so
>>>>> good...
>
> I've been able to update using sideloading.  WOO-HOO.  Sort of.
>
>>>> One of the things Android phone/tablet users brag about
>>>> (endlessly) is that their phones/tablets can expand memory by
>>>> plugging in an SD card. Trouble is, the phone/tablet won't USE
>>>> that memory for anything but 'external storage'.  You can't
>>>> install some apps there, and you can't use it for 'system work
>>>> space'.  In the end, you have a lot of memory, you can't just
>>>> use.
>>>
>>> Exactly right.  I can only conclude that the manufacturers and
>>> reviewers refrain from mentioning this little detriment for obvious
>>> reasons.  A number of people in the android newsgroup were as
>>> shocked as I was to find out that 4GB of internal memory is all
>>> that you can actually use.
>>>
>>> That being said, I searched the entire device for TED and found
>>> only the file on my external card.  Either it's actually running
>>> from the card (apparently this is something that the writers of
>>> apps can control, which makes me wonder why they don't ALL do this)
>>> or it installed into some area I can't see.  I've found various
>>> installed files for other apps before, so perhaps the TED guy did
>>> something extraordinary.
>>>
>>> Osmand and Co-Pilot can store their maps on the external card;
>>> osmand gives you this choice within the UI, but Co-Pilot requires
>>> that you edit an .ini-type file, the instructions for which I found
>>> on line SOMEWHERE.
>
> It's no longer there, but I have a 405K pdf file which I'll be happy to
> email to anyone who wants it.
>
>>>> At least on my iPhone, the free memory can always be used, and I
>>>>  don't have to go and delete apps in order to update other apps.
>>>>  There are some ugly 'features' that are hidden behind the hype,
>>>>  in both OSs, but I have come to really dislike the Android (4.1)
>>>>  OS.
>>>
>>> If I'd known I probably would have bought something with maybe 32
>>> gb of internal memory, but maybe not -- they're too expensive.
>>>
>>> BLU makes a phone with more internal memory AND a slot for a card.
>>>  If BLU figures this is a warranty problem (warranty is almost up)
>>>  maybe I can swap this phone for the better one by paying the
>>> difference.  Or not.
>
> Nope.  They just say I should do a factory reset.
>
>>> What gripes me is that I've got something like $45 in credit at
>>> the google play store which I don't think I can access by
>>> sideloading. I've only found a few apps I was willing to pay for,
>>> but still...
>>
>> Maybe you too have an Android 4.1 device like Ron?  Since 4.2, this
>> has been possible.
>> https://play.google.com/store/apps/details?id=com.a0soft.gphone.app2sd&hl=en
>>
>>
>> And there is a simple way to force move apps for those that choose
>> to.
>> http://techgage.com/article/moving_your_non-movable_android_apps_to_an_sd_card/
>>
>
> 4.2.1.
>
> I tried the first.  I've saved the second, but (a) I have to become
> familiar enough with windows to do what needs to be done; and (b) I
> suspect that that will have the same limitation as the first.
>
> My phone refers to internal memory as "sdcard".  It has less space
> available than what's called "phone" and is far more critical regarding
> an acceptable level of free space.  If the 'sdcard' falls below ~70 MB
> (out of 1 GB) I'm notified that I don't have enough space to do stuff
> (like download email, for instance) even though I still have over 1 GB
> of space in the
> "phone" area.
>
> Accordingly, the ability to move stuff to the 'sdcard' is useless;  the
> damn thing is nearly full and I've moved as much as possible to the
> 'phone' area.  I would really like to be able to sort the apps by phone
> or sdcard location so I wouldn't have to trial-and-error the process
> when I need more 'sdcard' space.
>
> Perhaps the second place will tell me how to substitute /sdcard1 for
> sdcard, in which case it might be useful;  just moving
> otherwise-immobile apps to the 'sdcard' is useless.
>
> My current problem is that the Play Store has become unusable.  In every
> instance it tells me there is not enough space to install or update an
> app, even though I deleted FIVE apps in order to free up enough space.
> I can download an app to my computer using
> http://apps.evozi.com/apk-downloader/?id=com.ted.android (which for some
> reason now wants Chrome instead of Firefox) or
> http://market.1mobile.com/?from=new_version and sideload it to my phone
> with no space problem whatsoever.
>
> I can't fix the play store app(s).  I have emailed both BLU and google
> asking them to email me the .apk files necessary to do this.  Otherwise
> I will have to do a backup and factory reset, a process which is highly
> undesirable due to the fact that I have to add in all the passwords and
> personalizations by hand.  Yes, I've done that.  I hated it.
>
> The reason I'm even considering it is that there are a number of pay
> apps I'd like to have (co-pilot voice direction, for one) that I have
> $45 worth of credit for.  I'm hoping that BLU and google come through
> with a fix.
>
The memory use area is one in which iOS has a very definite advantage.
No such problems worrying about where things need to go, of if you have
enough memory of a certain type.  It does a great job managing memory.
Where Android phones seem to be up to 3GB internal memory, the iOS
machines are still doing just fine with 1GB.  Better memory management,
or better hardware/firmware architecture?  I don't know, but whatever it
is that requires I delete apps in order to be able to update current
ones might well be a factor in Apple's ecology being more successful.

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Re: OT -- Android 4.2.1 nastiness

The Real Bev
On 10/13/2014 05:49 PM, Ron Hunter wrote:

> On 10/13/2014 3:48 PM, The Real Bev wrote:
>> On 10/09/2014 03:31 PM, [hidden email] wrote:
>>> On 10/5/2014 10:36 AM On a whim, The Real Bev pounded out on the
>>> keyboard
>>>
>>>> On 10/05/2014 01:36 AM, Ron Hunter wrote:
>>>>> On 10/5/2014 1:19 AM, The Real Bev wrote:
>>>>>> On 10/04/2014 11:02 PM, The Real Bev wrote:
>>>>>>> On 10/04/2014 06:27 PM, responder wrote:
>>>>>>>> On 10/4/2014 7:13 PM, The Real Bev wrote:
>>>>>>>>> Suddenly, although I have 1.2 GB available in my 'phone'
>>>>>>>>>  partition and 90 MB available in my 'internal storage'
>>>>>>>>> partition, I'm told I don't have enough space to update
>>>>>>>>> ANY of the 10 or so apps that attempted to auto-update.
>>>>>>>>> I deleted an app and was told I didn't have enough space
>>>>>>>>> to even reinstall it.  A bit of searching reveals that
>>>>>>>>> this problem exists for a number of different brands of
>>>>>>>>> phones, so I conclude it's an Android glitch.
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> I did what the google website (about as inadequate for
>>>>>>>>> Android as it's possible to be) suggested (clearing the
>>>>>>>>> data and cache for play store and download manager) and
>>>>>>>>> spent at least half an hour on the phone with some nice
>>>>>>>>> google ladies who were completely unable to help because
>>>>>>>>>  they really only knew about Nexus phones, not others.
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> I'm really shocked that google sells Android to other
>>>>>>>>> manufacturers but has no OS-only help facility at all --
>>>>>>>>>  especially when there seem to be OS-related problems
>>>>>>>>> that have nothing at all to do with the hardware it's
>>>>>>>>> installed on.
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> Anyway, I'm using the scattergun approach to finding a
>>>>>>>>> solution.  I've posted into some appropriate places and
>>>>>>>>> I've emailed BLU, but they normally take a couple of days
>>>>>>>>> to respond and they'll probably tell me to do a factory
>>>>>>>>> reset -- which will probably solve the problem, but is
>>>>>>>>> clearly undesirable.
>>>>>>>> Join the crowd.
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> I have the same issues.
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> My current phone is about 8 mos old and I had to replace it
>>>>>>>> about 2 months ago for some problem that persisted, The
>>>>>>>> replacements are fine.
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> I had the original phones rooted and this solved the memory
>>>>>>>> problem. When they had to be replaced in warranty, since
>>>>>>>> rooting voids that warranty, I un-rooted them first,
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> Now, after experiencing the same situation as you, I'm
>>>>>>>> getting ready to root again.
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> Good luck..
>>>>>>> I found a notification for updating Firefox NOT through the
>>>>>>> play store. It seemed to go perfectly, but I can't remember
>>>>>>> what the old version number was.  It's now 32.0.  Is that the
>>>>>>> latest for Android?
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> If sideloading or going through other non-playstore sites
>>>>>>> works fine, that would seem to narrow it down to a playstore
>>>>>>>  problem, wouldn't it?
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> Except for the 4-GB internal memory problem (which I should
>>>>>>> have known about, except it's not publicized by the
>>>>>>> manufacturers or the reviewers, who just say the unit has an
>>>>>>>  external sdcard slot and if you want to believe that you can
>>>>>>>  run apps from it, well, that's OK with them, it's not THEIR
>>>>>>>  job to educate you) I like the BLU phone.  When the camera
>>>>>>> was bad (out of the box, no distant focus) they replaced it
>>>>>>> quickly and I think they sent me a prepaid UPS label.  I'm
>>>>>>> going to phone them Monday or Tuesday...
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> I've never seen anything about rooting this phone, so I'm not
>>>>>>> even going to consider that.
>>>>>> Addendum:  It's definitely the play store -- I just downloaded
>>>>>>  the TED .apk file, copied it to my external sd card and
>>>>>> installed it from there. No problem.  Google seems to be if not
>>>>>> actually evil a little less good than it claims to be.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Find the URL for the app you want to download -- or maybe even
>>>>>>  update, I haven't tried that yet -- and feed it into this
>>>>>> website: http://apps.evozi.com , If you're running chrome you
>>>>>> can get an extension to do it and save a step.  So far so
>>>>>> good...
>>
>> I've been able to update using sideloading.  WOO-HOO.  Sort of.
>>
>>>>> One of the things Android phone/tablet users brag about
>>>>> (endlessly) is that their phones/tablets can expand memory by
>>>>> plugging in an SD card. Trouble is, the phone/tablet won't USE
>>>>> that memory for anything but 'external storage'.  You can't
>>>>> install some apps there, and you can't use it for 'system work
>>>>> space'.  In the end, you have a lot of memory, you can't just
>>>>> use.
>>>>
>>>> Exactly right.  I can only conclude that the manufacturers and
>>>> reviewers refrain from mentioning this little detriment for obvious
>>>> reasons.  A number of people in the android newsgroup were as
>>>> shocked as I was to find out that 4GB of internal memory is all
>>>> that you can actually use.
>>>>
>>>> That being said, I searched the entire device for TED and found
>>>> only the file on my external card.  Either it's actually running
>>>> from the card (apparently this is something that the writers of
>>>> apps can control, which makes me wonder why they don't ALL do this)
>>>> or it installed into some area I can't see.  I've found various
>>>> installed files for other apps before, so perhaps the TED guy did
>>>> something extraordinary.
>>>>
>>>> Osmand and Co-Pilot can store their maps on the external card;
>>>> osmand gives you this choice within the UI, but Co-Pilot requires
>>>> that you edit an .ini-type file, the instructions for which I found
>>>> on line SOMEWHERE.
>>
>> It's no longer there, but I have a 405K pdf file which I'll be happy to
>> email to anyone who wants it.
>>
>>>>> At least on my iPhone, the free memory can always be used, and I
>>>>>  don't have to go and delete apps in order to update other apps.
>>>>>  There are some ugly 'features' that are hidden behind the hype,
>>>>>  in both OSs, but I have come to really dislike the Android (4.1)
>>>>>  OS.
>>>>
>>>> If I'd known I probably would have bought something with maybe 32
>>>> gb of internal memory, but maybe not -- they're too expensive.
>>>>
>>>> BLU makes a phone with more internal memory AND a slot for a card.
>>>>  If BLU figures this is a warranty problem (warranty is almost up)
>>>>  maybe I can swap this phone for the better one by paying the
>>>> difference.  Or not.
>>
>> Nope.  They just say I should do a factory reset.
>>
>>>> What gripes me is that I've got something like $45 in credit at
>>>> the google play store which I don't think I can access by
>>>> sideloading. I've only found a few apps I was willing to pay for,
>>>> but still...
>>>
>>> Maybe you too have an Android 4.1 device like Ron?  Since 4.2, this
>>> has been possible.
>>> https://play.google.com/store/apps/details?id=com.a0soft.gphone.app2sd&hl=en
>>>
>>>
>>> And there is a simple way to force move apps for those that choose
>>> to.
>>> http://techgage.com/article/moving_your_non-movable_android_apps_to_an_sd_card/
>>>
>>
>> 4.2.1.
>>
>> I tried the first.  I've saved the second, but (a) I have to become
>> familiar enough with windows to do what needs to be done; and (b) I
>> suspect that that will have the same limitation as the first.
>>
>> My phone refers to internal memory as "sdcard".  It has less space
>> available than what's called "phone" and is far more critical regarding
>> an acceptable level of free space.  If the 'sdcard' falls below ~70 MB
>> (out of 1 GB) I'm notified that I don't have enough space to do stuff
>> (like download email, for instance) even though I still have over 1 GB
>> of space in the
>> "phone" area.
>>
>> Accordingly, the ability to move stuff to the 'sdcard' is useless;  the
>> damn thing is nearly full and I've moved as much as possible to the
>> 'phone' area.  I would really like to be able to sort the apps by phone
>> or sdcard location so I wouldn't have to trial-and-error the process
>> when I need more 'sdcard' space.
>>
>> Perhaps the second place will tell me how to substitute /sdcard1 for
>> sdcard, in which case it might be useful;  just moving
>> otherwise-immobile apps to the 'sdcard' is useless.
>>
>> My current problem is that the Play Store has become unusable.  In every
>> instance it tells me there is not enough space to install or update an
>> app, even though I deleted FIVE apps in order to free up enough space.
>> I can download an app to my computer using
>> http://apps.evozi.com/apk-downloader/?id=com.ted.android (which for some
>> reason now wants Chrome instead of Firefox) or
>> http://market.1mobile.com/?from=new_version and sideload it to my phone
>> with no space problem whatsoever.
>>
>> I can't fix the play store app(s).  I have emailed both BLU and google
>> asking them to email me the .apk files necessary to do this.  Otherwise
>> I will have to do a backup and factory reset, a process which is highly
>> undesirable due to the fact that I have to add in all the passwords and
>> personalizations by hand.  Yes, I've done that.  I hated it.
>>
>> The reason I'm even considering it is that there are a number of pay
>> apps I'd like to have (co-pilot voice direction, for one) that I have
>> $45 worth of credit for.  I'm hoping that BLU and google come through
>> with a fix.
>>
> The memory use area is one in which iOS has a very definite advantage.
> No such problems worrying about where things need to go, of if you have
> enough memory of a certain type.  It does a great job managing memory.
> Where Android phones seem to be up to 3GB internal memory, the iOS
> machines are still doing just fine with 1GB.  Better memory management,
> or better hardware/firmware architecture?  I don't know, but whatever it
> is that requires I delete apps in order to be able to update current
> ones might well be a factor in Apple's ecology being more successful.

The amount of internal memory is the most important thing.  What's the
least an iProduct has?  I bet it's more than 4 GB.

It's really stupid for me to obsess over this.  I should just buy a
Samsung phone with 32 GB of memory and stop worrying.  Unfortunately, I
am incapable of throwing away a still-useful $150 item in order to buy a
better $500 item :-(

I really don't want an iProduct.  Even without the premium price, the
illusion of eliteness is disgusting.

--
Cheers, Bev
==============================================
"Is there any way I can help without actually getting involved?"
                                              -- Jennifer, WKRP
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Re: OT -- Android 4.2.1 nastiness

WaltS48
On 10/17/2014 04:04 PM, The Real Bev wrote:
> I really don't want an iProduct.  Even without the premium price, the
> illusion of eliteness is disgusting.

+1

--
Sponsored by Firefox 34.0b1 and Thunderbird 31.2.0
GO Steelers, Pitt, Pens, Bills and Sabres!
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Re: OT -- Android 4.2.1 nastiness

Ron Hunter
In reply to this post by The Real Bev
On 10/17/2014 3:04 PM, The Real Bev wrote:

> On 10/13/2014 05:49 PM, Ron Hunter wrote:
>> On 10/13/2014 3:48 PM, The Real Bev wrote:
>>> On 10/09/2014 03:31 PM, [hidden email] wrote:
>>>> On 10/5/2014 10:36 AM On a whim, The Real Bev pounded out on the
>>>> keyboard
>>>>
>>>>> On 10/05/2014 01:36 AM, Ron Hunter wrote:
>>>>>> On 10/5/2014 1:19 AM, The Real Bev wrote:
>>>>>>> On 10/04/2014 11:02 PM, The Real Bev wrote:
>>>>>>>> On 10/04/2014 06:27 PM, responder wrote:
>>>>>>>>> On 10/4/2014 7:13 PM, The Real Bev wrote:
>>>>>>>>>> Suddenly, although I have 1.2 GB available in my 'phone'
>>>>>>>>>>  partition and 90 MB available in my 'internal storage'
>>>>>>>>>> partition, I'm told I don't have enough space to update
>>>>>>>>>> ANY of the 10 or so apps that attempted to auto-update.
>>>>>>>>>> I deleted an app and was told I didn't have enough space
>>>>>>>>>> to even reinstall it.  A bit of searching reveals that
>>>>>>>>>> this problem exists for a number of different brands of
>>>>>>>>>> phones, so I conclude it's an Android glitch.
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>> I did what the google website (about as inadequate for
>>>>>>>>>> Android as it's possible to be) suggested (clearing the
>>>>>>>>>> data and cache for play store and download manager) and
>>>>>>>>>> spent at least half an hour on the phone with some nice
>>>>>>>>>> google ladies who were completely unable to help because
>>>>>>>>>>  they really only knew about Nexus phones, not others.
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>> I'm really shocked that google sells Android to other
>>>>>>>>>> manufacturers but has no OS-only help facility at all --
>>>>>>>>>>  especially when there seem to be OS-related problems
>>>>>>>>>> that have nothing at all to do with the hardware it's
>>>>>>>>>> installed on.
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>> Anyway, I'm using the scattergun approach to finding a
>>>>>>>>>> solution.  I've posted into some appropriate places and
>>>>>>>>>> I've emailed BLU, but they normally take a couple of days
>>>>>>>>>> to respond and they'll probably tell me to do a factory
>>>>>>>>>> reset -- which will probably solve the problem, but is
>>>>>>>>>> clearly undesirable.
>>>>>>>>> Join the crowd.
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> I have the same issues.
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> My current phone is about 8 mos old and I had to replace it
>>>>>>>>> about 2 months ago for some problem that persisted, The
>>>>>>>>> replacements are fine.
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> I had the original phones rooted and this solved the memory
>>>>>>>>> problem. When they had to be replaced in warranty, since
>>>>>>>>> rooting voids that warranty, I un-rooted them first,
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> Now, after experiencing the same situation as you, I'm
>>>>>>>>> getting ready to root again.
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> Good luck..
>>>>>>>> I found a notification for updating Firefox NOT through the
>>>>>>>> play store. It seemed to go perfectly, but I can't remember
>>>>>>>> what the old version number was.  It's now 32.0.  Is that the
>>>>>>>> latest for Android?
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> If sideloading or going through other non-playstore sites
>>>>>>>> works fine, that would seem to narrow it down to a playstore
>>>>>>>>  problem, wouldn't it?
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> Except for the 4-GB internal memory problem (which I should
>>>>>>>> have known about, except it's not publicized by the
>>>>>>>> manufacturers or the reviewers, who just say the unit has an
>>>>>>>>  external sdcard slot and if you want to believe that you can
>>>>>>>>  run apps from it, well, that's OK with them, it's not THEIR
>>>>>>>>  job to educate you) I like the BLU phone.  When the camera
>>>>>>>> was bad (out of the box, no distant focus) they replaced it
>>>>>>>> quickly and I think they sent me a prepaid UPS label.  I'm
>>>>>>>> going to phone them Monday or Tuesday...
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> I've never seen anything about rooting this phone, so I'm not
>>>>>>>> even going to consider that.
>>>>>>> Addendum:  It's definitely the play store -- I just downloaded
>>>>>>>  the TED .apk file, copied it to my external sd card and
>>>>>>> installed it from there. No problem.  Google seems to be if not
>>>>>>> actually evil a little less good than it claims to be.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> Find the URL for the app you want to download -- or maybe even
>>>>>>>  update, I haven't tried that yet -- and feed it into this
>>>>>>> website: http://apps.evozi.com , If you're running chrome you
>>>>>>> can get an extension to do it and save a step.  So far so
>>>>>>> good...
>>>
>>> I've been able to update using sideloading.  WOO-HOO.  Sort of.
>>>
>>>>>> One of the things Android phone/tablet users brag about
>>>>>> (endlessly) is that their phones/tablets can expand memory by
>>>>>> plugging in an SD card. Trouble is, the phone/tablet won't USE
>>>>>> that memory for anything but 'external storage'.  You can't
>>>>>> install some apps there, and you can't use it for 'system work
>>>>>> space'.  In the end, you have a lot of memory, you can't just
>>>>>> use.
>>>>>
>>>>> Exactly right.  I can only conclude that the manufacturers and
>>>>> reviewers refrain from mentioning this little detriment for obvious
>>>>> reasons.  A number of people in the android newsgroup were as
>>>>> shocked as I was to find out that 4GB of internal memory is all
>>>>> that you can actually use.
>>>>>
>>>>> That being said, I searched the entire device for TED and found
>>>>> only the file on my external card.  Either it's actually running
>>>>> from the card (apparently this is something that the writers of
>>>>> apps can control, which makes me wonder why they don't ALL do this)
>>>>> or it installed into some area I can't see.  I've found various
>>>>> installed files for other apps before, so perhaps the TED guy did
>>>>> something extraordinary.
>>>>>
>>>>> Osmand and Co-Pilot can store their maps on the external card;
>>>>> osmand gives you this choice within the UI, but Co-Pilot requires
>>>>> that you edit an .ini-type file, the instructions for which I found
>>>>> on line SOMEWHERE.
>>>
>>> It's no longer there, but I have a 405K pdf file which I'll be happy to
>>> email to anyone who wants it.
>>>
>>>>>> At least on my iPhone, the free memory can always be used, and I
>>>>>>  don't have to go and delete apps in order to update other apps.
>>>>>>  There are some ugly 'features' that are hidden behind the hype,
>>>>>>  in both OSs, but I have come to really dislike the Android (4.1)
>>>>>>  OS.
>>>>>
>>>>> If I'd known I probably would have bought something with maybe 32
>>>>> gb of internal memory, but maybe not -- they're too expensive.
>>>>>
>>>>> BLU makes a phone with more internal memory AND a slot for a card.
>>>>>  If BLU figures this is a warranty problem (warranty is almost up)
>>>>>  maybe I can swap this phone for the better one by paying the
>>>>> difference.  Or not.
>>>
>>> Nope.  They just say I should do a factory reset.
>>>
>>>>> What gripes me is that I've got something like $45 in credit at
>>>>> the google play store which I don't think I can access by
>>>>> sideloading. I've only found a few apps I was willing to pay for,
>>>>> but still...
>>>>
>>>> Maybe you too have an Android 4.1 device like Ron?  Since 4.2, this
>>>> has been possible.
>>>> https://play.google.com/store/apps/details?id=com.a0soft.gphone.app2sd&hl=en
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> And there is a simple way to force move apps for those that choose
>>>> to.
>>>> http://techgage.com/article/moving_your_non-movable_android_apps_to_an_sd_card/
>>>>
>>>>
>>>
>>> 4.2.1.
>>>
>>> I tried the first.  I've saved the second, but (a) I have to become
>>> familiar enough with windows to do what needs to be done; and (b) I
>>> suspect that that will have the same limitation as the first.
>>>
>>> My phone refers to internal memory as "sdcard".  It has less space
>>> available than what's called "phone" and is far more critical regarding
>>> an acceptable level of free space.  If the 'sdcard' falls below ~70 MB
>>> (out of 1 GB) I'm notified that I don't have enough space to do stuff
>>> (like download email, for instance) even though I still have over 1 GB
>>> of space in the
>>> "phone" area.
>>>
>>> Accordingly, the ability to move stuff to the 'sdcard' is useless;  the
>>> damn thing is nearly full and I've moved as much as possible to the
>>> 'phone' area.  I would really like to be able to sort the apps by phone
>>> or sdcard location so I wouldn't have to trial-and-error the process
>>> when I need more 'sdcard' space.
>>>
>>> Perhaps the second place will tell me how to substitute /sdcard1 for
>>> sdcard, in which case it might be useful;  just moving
>>> otherwise-immobile apps to the 'sdcard' is useless.
>>>
>>> My current problem is that the Play Store has become unusable.  In every
>>> instance it tells me there is not enough space to install or update an
>>> app, even though I deleted FIVE apps in order to free up enough space.
>>> I can download an app to my computer using
>>> http://apps.evozi.com/apk-downloader/?id=com.ted.android (which for some
>>> reason now wants Chrome instead of Firefox) or
>>> http://market.1mobile.com/?from=new_version and sideload it to my phone
>>> with no space problem whatsoever.
>>>
>>> I can't fix the play store app(s).  I have emailed both BLU and google
>>> asking them to email me the .apk files necessary to do this.  Otherwise
>>> I will have to do a backup and factory reset, a process which is highly
>>> undesirable due to the fact that I have to add in all the passwords and
>>> personalizations by hand.  Yes, I've done that.  I hated it.
>>>
>>> The reason I'm even considering it is that there are a number of pay
>>> apps I'd like to have (co-pilot voice direction, for one) that I have
>>> $45 worth of credit for.  I'm hoping that BLU and google come through
>>> with a fix.
>>>
>> The memory use area is one in which iOS has a very definite advantage.
>> No such problems worrying about where things need to go, of if you have
>> enough memory of a certain type.  It does a great job managing memory.
>> Where Android phones seem to be up to 3GB internal memory, the iOS
>> machines are still doing just fine with 1GB.  Better memory management,
>> or better hardware/firmware architecture?  I don't know, but whatever it
>> is that requires I delete apps in order to be able to update current
>> ones might well be a factor in Apple's ecology being more successful.
>
> The amount of internal memory is the most important thing.  What's the
> least an iProduct has?  I bet it's more than 4 GB.
>
> It's really stupid for me to obsess over this.  I should just buy a
> Samsung phone with 32 GB of memory and stop worrying.  Unfortunately, I
> am incapable of throwing away a still-useful $150 item in order to buy a
> better $500 item :-(
>
> I really don't want an iProduct.  Even without the premium price, the
> illusion of eliteness is disgusting.
>
Illusion of eliteness?  What an irrelevant reason to not buy a device.
It seems to me that memory management is very good on the iPhone, as I
have only 1 GB of memory, but even after days and days of use, I find I
have 363 MB of RAM available, even with the monitor app loaded.
Meanwhile, with NOTHING running on the Android tablet, same RAM, I have
162 MB available, which is often not enough to update a large program.
And, Apple fixes bugs, and distributes the fixed OS free, to just about
any device with the necessary hardware.  That was the point which tipped
me over to the iPhone.

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Re: OT -- Android 4.2.1 nastiness

Ed Mullen-9
Ron Hunter wrote on 10/17/2014 8:48 PM:

> On 10/17/2014 3:04 PM, The Real Bev wrote:
>> On 10/13/2014 05:49 PM, Ron Hunter wrote:
>>> On 10/13/2014 3:48 PM, The Real Bev wrote:
>>>> On 10/09/2014 03:31 PM, [hidden email] wrote:
>>>>> On 10/5/2014 10:36 AM On a whim, The Real Bev pounded out on the
>>>>> keyboard
>>>>>
>>>>>> On 10/05/2014 01:36 AM, Ron Hunter wrote:
>>>>>>> On 10/5/2014 1:19 AM, The Real Bev wrote:
>>>>>>>> On 10/04/2014 11:02 PM, The Real Bev wrote:
>>>>>>>>> On 10/04/2014 06:27 PM, responder wrote:
>>>>>>>>>> On 10/4/2014 7:13 PM, The Real Bev wrote:
>>>>>>>>>>> Suddenly, although I have 1.2 GB available in my 'phone'
>>>>>>>>>>>  partition and 90 MB available in my 'internal storage'
>>>>>>>>>>> partition, I'm told I don't have enough space to update
>>>>>>>>>>> ANY of the 10 or so apps that attempted to auto-update.
>>>>>>>>>>> I deleted an app and was told I didn't have enough space
>>>>>>>>>>> to even reinstall it.  A bit of searching reveals that
>>>>>>>>>>> this problem exists for a number of different brands of
>>>>>>>>>>> phones, so I conclude it's an Android glitch.
>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>> I did what the google website (about as inadequate for
>>>>>>>>>>> Android as it's possible to be) suggested (clearing the
>>>>>>>>>>> data and cache for play store and download manager) and
>>>>>>>>>>> spent at least half an hour on the phone with some nice
>>>>>>>>>>> google ladies who were completely unable to help because
>>>>>>>>>>>  they really only knew about Nexus phones, not others.
>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>> I'm really shocked that google sells Android to other
>>>>>>>>>>> manufacturers but has no OS-only help facility at all --
>>>>>>>>>>>  especially when there seem to be OS-related problems
>>>>>>>>>>> that have nothing at all to do with the hardware it's
>>>>>>>>>>> installed on.
>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>> Anyway, I'm using the scattergun approach to finding a
>>>>>>>>>>> solution.  I've posted into some appropriate places and
>>>>>>>>>>> I've emailed BLU, but they normally take a couple of days
>>>>>>>>>>> to respond and they'll probably tell me to do a factory
>>>>>>>>>>> reset -- which will probably solve the problem, but is
>>>>>>>>>>> clearly undesirable.
>>>>>>>>>> Join the crowd.
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>> I have the same issues.
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>> My current phone is about 8 mos old and I had to replace it
>>>>>>>>>> about 2 months ago for some problem that persisted, The
>>>>>>>>>> replacements are fine.
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>> I had the original phones rooted and this solved the memory
>>>>>>>>>> problem. When they had to be replaced in warranty, since
>>>>>>>>>> rooting voids that warranty, I un-rooted them first,
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>> Now, after experiencing the same situation as you, I'm
>>>>>>>>>> getting ready to root again.
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>> Good luck..
>>>>>>>>> I found a notification for updating Firefox NOT through the
>>>>>>>>> play store. It seemed to go perfectly, but I can't remember
>>>>>>>>> what the old version number was.  It's now 32.0.  Is that the
>>>>>>>>> latest for Android?
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> If sideloading or going through other non-playstore sites
>>>>>>>>> works fine, that would seem to narrow it down to a playstore
>>>>>>>>>  problem, wouldn't it?
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> Except for the 4-GB internal memory problem (which I should
>>>>>>>>> have known about, except it's not publicized by the
>>>>>>>>> manufacturers or the reviewers, who just say the unit has an
>>>>>>>>>  external sdcard slot and if you want to believe that you can
>>>>>>>>>  run apps from it, well, that's OK with them, it's not THEIR
>>>>>>>>>  job to educate you) I like the BLU phone.  When the camera
>>>>>>>>> was bad (out of the box, no distant focus) they replaced it
>>>>>>>>> quickly and I think they sent me a prepaid UPS label.  I'm
>>>>>>>>> going to phone them Monday or Tuesday...
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> I've never seen anything about rooting this phone, so I'm not
>>>>>>>>> even going to consider that.
>>>>>>>> Addendum:  It's definitely the play store -- I just downloaded
>>>>>>>>  the TED .apk file, copied it to my external sd card and
>>>>>>>> installed it from there. No problem.  Google seems to be if not
>>>>>>>> actually evil a little less good than it claims to be.
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> Find the URL for the app you want to download -- or maybe even
>>>>>>>>  update, I haven't tried that yet -- and feed it into this
>>>>>>>> website: http://apps.evozi.com , If you're running chrome you
>>>>>>>> can get an extension to do it and save a step.  So far so
>>>>>>>> good...
>>>>
>>>> I've been able to update using sideloading.  WOO-HOO.  Sort of.
>>>>
>>>>>>> One of the things Android phone/tablet users brag about
>>>>>>> (endlessly) is that their phones/tablets can expand memory by
>>>>>>> plugging in an SD card. Trouble is, the phone/tablet won't USE
>>>>>>> that memory for anything but 'external storage'.  You can't
>>>>>>> install some apps there, and you can't use it for 'system work
>>>>>>> space'.  In the end, you have a lot of memory, you can't just
>>>>>>> use.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Exactly right.  I can only conclude that the manufacturers and
>>>>>> reviewers refrain from mentioning this little detriment for obvious
>>>>>> reasons.  A number of people in the android newsgroup were as
>>>>>> shocked as I was to find out that 4GB of internal memory is all
>>>>>> that you can actually use.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> That being said, I searched the entire device for TED and found
>>>>>> only the file on my external card.  Either it's actually running
>>>>>> from the card (apparently this is something that the writers of
>>>>>> apps can control, which makes me wonder why they don't ALL do this)
>>>>>> or it installed into some area I can't see.  I've found various
>>>>>> installed files for other apps before, so perhaps the TED guy did
>>>>>> something extraordinary.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Osmand and Co-Pilot can store their maps on the external card;
>>>>>> osmand gives you this choice within the UI, but Co-Pilot requires
>>>>>> that you edit an .ini-type file, the instructions for which I found
>>>>>> on line SOMEWHERE.
>>>>
>>>> It's no longer there, but I have a 405K pdf file which I'll be happy to
>>>> email to anyone who wants it.
>>>>
>>>>>>> At least on my iPhone, the free memory can always be used, and I
>>>>>>>  don't have to go and delete apps in order to update other apps.
>>>>>>>  There are some ugly 'features' that are hidden behind the hype,
>>>>>>>  in both OSs, but I have come to really dislike the Android (4.1)
>>>>>>>  OS.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> If I'd known I probably would have bought something with maybe 32
>>>>>> gb of internal memory, but maybe not -- they're too expensive.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> BLU makes a phone with more internal memory AND a slot for a card.
>>>>>>  If BLU figures this is a warranty problem (warranty is almost up)
>>>>>>  maybe I can swap this phone for the better one by paying the
>>>>>> difference.  Or not.
>>>>
>>>> Nope.  They just say I should do a factory reset.
>>>>
>>>>>> What gripes me is that I've got something like $45 in credit at
>>>>>> the google play store which I don't think I can access by
>>>>>> sideloading. I've only found a few apps I was willing to pay for,
>>>>>> but still...
>>>>>
>>>>> Maybe you too have an Android 4.1 device like Ron?  Since 4.2, this
>>>>> has been possible.
>>>>> https://play.google.com/store/apps/details?id=com.a0soft.gphone.app2sd&hl=en
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>> And there is a simple way to force move apps for those that choose
>>>>> to.
>>>>> http://techgage.com/article/moving_your_non-movable_android_apps_to_an_sd_card/
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>
>>>> 4.2.1.
>>>>
>>>> I tried the first.  I've saved the second, but (a) I have to become
>>>> familiar enough with windows to do what needs to be done; and (b) I
>>>> suspect that that will have the same limitation as the first.
>>>>
>>>> My phone refers to internal memory as "sdcard".  It has less space
>>>> available than what's called "phone" and is far more critical regarding
>>>> an acceptable level of free space.  If the 'sdcard' falls below ~70 MB
>>>> (out of 1 GB) I'm notified that I don't have enough space to do stuff
>>>> (like download email, for instance) even though I still have over 1 GB
>>>> of space in the
>>>> "phone" area.
>>>>
>>>> Accordingly, the ability to move stuff to the 'sdcard' is useless;  the
>>>> damn thing is nearly full and I've moved as much as possible to the
>>>> 'phone' area.  I would really like to be able to sort the apps by phone
>>>> or sdcard location so I wouldn't have to trial-and-error the process
>>>> when I need more 'sdcard' space.
>>>>
>>>> Perhaps the second place will tell me how to substitute /sdcard1 for
>>>> sdcard, in which case it might be useful;  just moving
>>>> otherwise-immobile apps to the 'sdcard' is useless.
>>>>
>>>> My current problem is that the Play Store has become unusable.  In
>>>> every
>>>> instance it tells me there is not enough space to install or update an
>>>> app, even though I deleted FIVE apps in order to free up enough space.
>>>> I can download an app to my computer using
>>>> http://apps.evozi.com/apk-downloader/?id=com.ted.android (which for
>>>> some
>>>> reason now wants Chrome instead of Firefox) or
>>>> http://market.1mobile.com/?from=new_version and sideload it to my phone
>>>> with no space problem whatsoever.
>>>>
>>>> I can't fix the play store app(s).  I have emailed both BLU and google
>>>> asking them to email me the .apk files necessary to do this.  Otherwise
>>>> I will have to do a backup and factory reset, a process which is highly
>>>> undesirable due to the fact that I have to add in all the passwords and
>>>> personalizations by hand.  Yes, I've done that.  I hated it.
>>>>
>>>> The reason I'm even considering it is that there are a number of pay
>>>> apps I'd like to have (co-pilot voice direction, for one) that I have
>>>> $45 worth of credit for.  I'm hoping that BLU and google come through
>>>> with a fix.
>>>>
>>> The memory use area is one in which iOS has a very definite advantage.
>>> No such problems worrying about where things need to go, of if you have
>>> enough memory of a certain type.  It does a great job managing memory.
>>> Where Android phones seem to be up to 3GB internal memory, the iOS
>>> machines are still doing just fine with 1GB.  Better memory management,
>>> or better hardware/firmware architecture?  I don't know, but whatever it
>>> is that requires I delete apps in order to be able to update current
>>> ones might well be a factor in Apple's ecology being more successful.
>>
>> The amount of internal memory is the most important thing.  What's the
>> least an iProduct has?  I bet it's more than 4 GB.
>>
>> It's really stupid for me to obsess over this.  I should just buy a
>> Samsung phone with 32 GB of memory and stop worrying.  Unfortunately, I
>> am incapable of throwing away a still-useful $150 item in order to buy a
>> better $500 item :-(
>>
>> I really don't want an iProduct.  Even without the premium price, the
>> illusion of eliteness is disgusting.
>>
> Illusion of eliteness?  What an irrelevant reason to not buy a device.
> It seems to me that memory management is very good on the iPhone, as I
> have only 1 GB of memory, but even after days and days of use, I find I
> have 363 MB of RAM available, even with the monitor app loaded.
> Meanwhile, with NOTHING running on the Android tablet, same RAM, I have
> 162 MB available, which is often not enough to update a large program.
> And, Apple fixes bugs, and distributes the fixed OS free, to just about
> any device with the necessary hardware.  That was the point which tipped
> me over to the iPhone.
>

None of those numbers would be acceptable to me. My current phone is an
Amazon Fire Phone 32 Gb.  I have only about 1.2 Gbs used by the phone
and apps (many) that I've installed.


     4.7" HD LCD display
     1280x720 display (315ppi)
     1000:1 contrast ratio

It's as quirky as other phones but I love it.

Just showed it to two iPhone users and they are salivating.  And it take
s better pictures than my Nikon digital camera. Which I haven't used in
years.

And I concur on the issue of Applea eliteness.  Drink the cool-ade.

--
Ed Mullen
http://edmullen.net/
Optirectumitis - where the optic nerve gets crossed with the rectal
nerve resulting in a crappy outlook on life.
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Re: OT -- Android 4.2.1 nastiness

Ron Hunter
On 10/17/2014 8:11 PM, Ed Mullen wrote:

> Ron Hunter wrote on 10/17/2014 8:48 PM:
>> On 10/17/2014 3:04 PM, The Real Bev wrote:
>>> On 10/13/2014 05:49 PM, Ron Hunter wrote:
>>>> On 10/13/2014 3:48 PM, The Real Bev wrote:
>>>>> On 10/09/2014 03:31 PM, [hidden email] wrote:
>>>>>> On 10/5/2014 10:36 AM On a whim, The Real Bev pounded out on the
>>>>>> keyboard
>>>>>>
>>>>>>> On 10/05/2014 01:36 AM, Ron Hunter wrote:
>>>>>>>> On 10/5/2014 1:19 AM, The Real Bev wrote:
>>>>>>>>> On 10/04/2014 11:02 PM, The Real Bev wrote:
>>>>>>>>>> On 10/04/2014 06:27 PM, responder wrote:
>>>>>>>>>>> On 10/4/2014 7:13 PM, The Real Bev wrote:
>>>>>>>>>>>> Suddenly, although I have 1.2 GB available in my 'phone'
>>>>>>>>>>>>  partition and 90 MB available in my 'internal storage'
>>>>>>>>>>>> partition, I'm told I don't have enough space to update
>>>>>>>>>>>> ANY of the 10 or so apps that attempted to auto-update.
>>>>>>>>>>>> I deleted an app and was told I didn't have enough space
>>>>>>>>>>>> to even reinstall it.  A bit of searching reveals that
>>>>>>>>>>>> this problem exists for a number of different brands of
>>>>>>>>>>>> phones, so I conclude it's an Android glitch.
>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>> I did what the google website (about as inadequate for
>>>>>>>>>>>> Android as it's possible to be) suggested (clearing the
>>>>>>>>>>>> data and cache for play store and download manager) and
>>>>>>>>>>>> spent at least half an hour on the phone with some nice
>>>>>>>>>>>> google ladies who were completely unable to help because
>>>>>>>>>>>>  they really only knew about Nexus phones, not others.
>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>> I'm really shocked that google sells Android to other
>>>>>>>>>>>> manufacturers but has no OS-only help facility at all --
>>>>>>>>>>>>  especially when there seem to be OS-related problems
>>>>>>>>>>>> that have nothing at all to do with the hardware it's
>>>>>>>>>>>> installed on.
>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>> Anyway, I'm using the scattergun approach to finding a
>>>>>>>>>>>> solution.  I've posted into some appropriate places and
>>>>>>>>>>>> I've emailed BLU, but they normally take a couple of days
>>>>>>>>>>>> to respond and they'll probably tell me to do a factory
>>>>>>>>>>>> reset -- which will probably solve the problem, but is
>>>>>>>>>>>> clearly undesirable.
>>>>>>>>>>> Join the crowd.
>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>> I have the same issues.
>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>> My current phone is about 8 mos old and I had to replace it
>>>>>>>>>>> about 2 months ago for some problem that persisted, The
>>>>>>>>>>> replacements are fine.
>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>> I had the original phones rooted and this solved the memory
>>>>>>>>>>> problem. When they had to be replaced in warranty, since
>>>>>>>>>>> rooting voids that warranty, I un-rooted them first,
>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>> Now, after experiencing the same situation as you, I'm
>>>>>>>>>>> getting ready to root again.
>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>> Good luck..
>>>>>>>>>> I found a notification for updating Firefox NOT through the
>>>>>>>>>> play store. It seemed to go perfectly, but I can't remember
>>>>>>>>>> what the old version number was.  It's now 32.0.  Is that the
>>>>>>>>>> latest for Android?
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>> If sideloading or going through other non-playstore sites
>>>>>>>>>> works fine, that would seem to narrow it down to a playstore
>>>>>>>>>>  problem, wouldn't it?
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>> Except for the 4-GB internal memory problem (which I should
>>>>>>>>>> have known about, except it's not publicized by the
>>>>>>>>>> manufacturers or the reviewers, who just say the unit has an
>>>>>>>>>>  external sdcard slot and if you want to believe that you can
>>>>>>>>>>  run apps from it, well, that's OK with them, it's not THEIR
>>>>>>>>>>  job to educate you) I like the BLU phone.  When the camera
>>>>>>>>>> was bad (out of the box, no distant focus) they replaced it
>>>>>>>>>> quickly and I think they sent me a prepaid UPS label.  I'm
>>>>>>>>>> going to phone them Monday or Tuesday...
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>> I've never seen anything about rooting this phone, so I'm not
>>>>>>>>>> even going to consider that.
>>>>>>>>> Addendum:  It's definitely the play store -- I just downloaded
>>>>>>>>>  the TED .apk file, copied it to my external sd card and
>>>>>>>>> installed it from there. No problem.  Google seems to be if not
>>>>>>>>> actually evil a little less good than it claims to be.
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> Find the URL for the app you want to download -- or maybe even
>>>>>>>>>  update, I haven't tried that yet -- and feed it into this
>>>>>>>>> website: http://apps.evozi.com , If you're running chrome you
>>>>>>>>> can get an extension to do it and save a step.  So far so
>>>>>>>>> good...
>>>>>
>>>>> I've been able to update using sideloading.  WOO-HOO.  Sort of.
>>>>>
>>>>>>>> One of the things Android phone/tablet users brag about
>>>>>>>> (endlessly) is that their phones/tablets can expand memory by
>>>>>>>> plugging in an SD card. Trouble is, the phone/tablet won't USE
>>>>>>>> that memory for anything but 'external storage'.  You can't
>>>>>>>> install some apps there, and you can't use it for 'system work
>>>>>>>> space'.  In the end, you have a lot of memory, you can't just
>>>>>>>> use.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> Exactly right.  I can only conclude that the manufacturers and
>>>>>>> reviewers refrain from mentioning this little detriment for obvious
>>>>>>> reasons.  A number of people in the android newsgroup were as
>>>>>>> shocked as I was to find out that 4GB of internal memory is all
>>>>>>> that you can actually use.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> That being said, I searched the entire device for TED and found
>>>>>>> only the file on my external card.  Either it's actually running
>>>>>>> from the card (apparently this is something that the writers of
>>>>>>> apps can control, which makes me wonder why they don't ALL do this)
>>>>>>> or it installed into some area I can't see.  I've found various
>>>>>>> installed files for other apps before, so perhaps the TED guy did
>>>>>>> something extraordinary.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> Osmand and Co-Pilot can store their maps on the external card;
>>>>>>> osmand gives you this choice within the UI, but Co-Pilot requires
>>>>>>> that you edit an .ini-type file, the instructions for which I found
>>>>>>> on line SOMEWHERE.
>>>>>
>>>>> It's no longer there, but I have a 405K pdf file which I'll be
>>>>> happy to
>>>>> email to anyone who wants it.
>>>>>
>>>>>>>> At least on my iPhone, the free memory can always be used, and I
>>>>>>>>  don't have to go and delete apps in order to update other apps.
>>>>>>>>  There are some ugly 'features' that are hidden behind the hype,
>>>>>>>>  in both OSs, but I have come to really dislike the Android (4.1)
>>>>>>>>  OS.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> If I'd known I probably would have bought something with maybe 32
>>>>>>> gb of internal memory, but maybe not -- they're too expensive.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> BLU makes a phone with more internal memory AND a slot for a card.
>>>>>>>  If BLU figures this is a warranty problem (warranty is almost up)
>>>>>>>  maybe I can swap this phone for the better one by paying the
>>>>>>> difference.  Or not.
>>>>>
>>>>> Nope.  They just say I should do a factory reset.
>>>>>
>>>>>>> What gripes me is that I've got something like $45 in credit at
>>>>>>> the google play store which I don't think I can access by
>>>>>>> sideloading. I've only found a few apps I was willing to pay for,
>>>>>>> but still...
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Maybe you too have an Android 4.1 device like Ron?  Since 4.2, this
>>>>>> has been possible.
>>>>>> https://play.google.com/store/apps/details?id=com.a0soft.gphone.app2sd&hl=en
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>> And there is a simple way to force move apps for those that choose
>>>>>> to.
>>>>>> http://techgage.com/article/moving_your_non-movable_android_apps_to_an_sd_card/
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>> 4.2.1.
>>>>>
>>>>> I tried the first.  I've saved the second, but (a) I have to become
>>>>> familiar enough with windows to do what needs to be done; and (b) I
>>>>> suspect that that will have the same limitation as the first.
>>>>>
>>>>> My phone refers to internal memory as "sdcard".  It has less space
>>>>> available than what's called "phone" and is far more critical
>>>>> regarding
>>>>> an acceptable level of free space.  If the 'sdcard' falls below ~70 MB
>>>>> (out of 1 GB) I'm notified that I don't have enough space to do stuff
>>>>> (like download email, for instance) even though I still have over 1 GB
>>>>> of space in the
>>>>> "phone" area.
>>>>>
>>>>> Accordingly, the ability to move stuff to the 'sdcard' is useless;
>>>>> the
>>>>> damn thing is nearly full and I've moved as much as possible to the
>>>>> 'phone' area.  I would really like to be able to sort the apps by
>>>>> phone
>>>>> or sdcard location so I wouldn't have to trial-and-error the process
>>>>> when I need more 'sdcard' space.
>>>>>
>>>>> Perhaps the second place will tell me how to substitute /sdcard1 for
>>>>> sdcard, in which case it might be useful;  just moving
>>>>> otherwise-immobile apps to the 'sdcard' is useless.
>>>>>
>>>>> My current problem is that the Play Store has become unusable.  In
>>>>> every
>>>>> instance it tells me there is not enough space to install or update an
>>>>> app, even though I deleted FIVE apps in order to free up enough space.
>>>>> I can download an app to my computer using
>>>>> http://apps.evozi.com/apk-downloader/?id=com.ted.android (which for
>>>>> some
>>>>> reason now wants Chrome instead of Firefox) or
>>>>> http://market.1mobile.com/?from=new_version and sideload it to my
>>>>> phone
>>>>> with no space problem whatsoever.
>>>>>
>>>>> I can't fix the play store app(s).  I have emailed both BLU and google
>>>>> asking them to email me the .apk files necessary to do this.
>>>>> Otherwise
>>>>> I will have to do a backup and factory reset, a process which is
>>>>> highly
>>>>> undesirable due to the fact that I have to add in all the passwords
>>>>> and
>>>>> personalizations by hand.  Yes, I've done that.  I hated it.
>>>>>
>>>>> The reason I'm even considering it is that there are a number of pay
>>>>> apps I'd like to have (co-pilot voice direction, for one) that I have
>>>>> $45 worth of credit for.  I'm hoping that BLU and google come through
>>>>> with a fix.
>>>>>
>>>> The memory use area is one in which iOS has a very definite advantage.
>>>> No such problems worrying about where things need to go, of if you have
>>>> enough memory of a certain type.  It does a great job managing memory.
>>>> Where Android phones seem to be up to 3GB internal memory, the iOS
>>>> machines are still doing just fine with 1GB.  Better memory management,
>>>> or better hardware/firmware architecture?  I don't know, but
>>>> whatever it
>>>> is that requires I delete apps in order to be able to update current
>>>> ones might well be a factor in Apple's ecology being more successful.
>>>
>>> The amount of internal memory is the most important thing.  What's the
>>> least an iProduct has?  I bet it's more than 4 GB.
>>>
>>> It's really stupid for me to obsess over this.  I should just buy a
>>> Samsung phone with 32 GB of memory and stop worrying.  Unfortunately, I
>>> am incapable of throwing away a still-useful $150 item in order to buy a
>>> better $500 item :-(
>>>
>>> I really don't want an iProduct.  Even without the premium price, the
>>> illusion of eliteness is disgusting.
>>>
>> Illusion of eliteness?  What an irrelevant reason to not buy a device.
>> It seems to me that memory management is very good on the iPhone, as I
>> have only 1 GB of memory, but even after days and days of use, I find I
>> have 363 MB of RAM available, even with the monitor app loaded.
>> Meanwhile, with NOTHING running on the Android tablet, same RAM, I have
>> 162 MB available, which is often not enough to update a large program.
>> And, Apple fixes bugs, and distributes the fixed OS free, to just about
>> any device with the necessary hardware.  That was the point which tipped
>> me over to the iPhone.
>>
>
> None of those numbers would be acceptable to me. My current phone is an
> Amazon Fire Phone 32 Gb.  I have only about 1.2 Gbs used by the phone
> and apps (many) that I've installed.
>
>
>      4.7" HD LCD display
>      1280x720 display (315ppi)
>      1000:1 contrast ratio
>
> It's as quirky as other phones but I love it.
>
> Just showed it to two iPhone users and they are salivating.  And it take
> s better pictures than my Nikon digital camera. Which I haven't used in
> years.
>
> And I concur on the issue of Applea eliteness.  Drink the cool-ade.
>
You do know that the Fire Phone is generally classed as the biggest flop
in the smartphone industry?  But if you are happy with it, that's great.
  All of which has nothing to do with which OS has the better memory
management.

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Re: OT -- Android 4.2.1 nastiness

F1Com
In reply to this post by The Real Bev
On 10/13/2014 1:48 PM On a whim, The Real Bev pounded out on the keyboard

> On 10/09/2014 03:31 PM, [hidden email] wrote:
>> Maybe you too have an Android 4.1 device like Ron?  Since 4.2, this
>> has been possible.
>> https://play.google.com/store/apps/details?id=com.a0soft.gphone.app2sd&hl=en
>>
>> And there is a simple way to force move apps for those that choose
>> to.
>> http://techgage.com/article/moving_your_non-movable_android_apps_to_an_sd_card/
>
> 4.2.1.
>
> I tried the first.  I've saved the second, but (a) I have to become
> familiar enough with windows to do what needs to be done; and (b) I
> suspect that that will have the same limitation as the first.
>
> My phone refers to internal memory as "sdcard".  It has less space
> available than what's called "phone" and is far more critical regarding
> an acceptable level of free space.  If the 'sdcard' falls below ~70 MB
> (out of 1 GB) I'm notified that I don't have enough space to do stuff
> (like download email, for instance) even though I still have over 1 GB
> of space in the
> "phone" area.
>
> Accordingly, the ability to move stuff to the 'sdcard' is useless;  the
> damn thing is nearly full and I've moved as much as possible to the
> 'phone' area.  I would really like to be able to sort the apps by phone
> or sdcard location so I wouldn't have to trial-and-error the process
> when I need more 'sdcard' space.
>
> Perhaps the second place will tell me how to substitute /sdcard1 for
> sdcard, in which case it might be useful;  just moving
> otherwise-immobile apps to the 'sdcard' is useless.
>
> My current problem is that the Play Store has become unusable.  In every
> instance it tells me there is not enough space to install or update an
> app, even though I deleted FIVE apps in order to free up enough space.
> I can download an app to my computer using
> http://apps.evozi.com/apk-downloader/?id=com.ted.android (which for some
> reason now wants Chrome instead of Firefox) or
> http://market.1mobile.com/?from=new_version and sideload it to my phone
> with no space problem whatsoever.
>
> I can't fix the play store app(s).  I have emailed both BLU and google
> asking them to email me the .apk files necessary to do this.  Otherwise
> I will have to do a backup and factory reset, a process which is highly
> undesirable due to the fact that I have to add in all the passwords and
> personalizations by hand.  Yes, I've done that.  I hated it.
>
> The reason I'm even considering it is that there are a number of pay
> apps I'd like to have (co-pilot voice direction, for one) that I have
> $45 worth of credit for.  I'm hoping that BLU and google come through
> with a fix.
>

The limitation I doubt is Android, it must be something on your phone.
No problems on a Nexus 5, HTC, or Samsung X5.



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Re: OT -- Android 4.2.1 nastiness

F1Com
In reply to this post by Ron Hunter
On 10/13/2014 5:49 PM On a whim, Ron Hunter pounded out on the keyboard

> On 10/13/2014 3:48 PM, The Real Bev wrote:
>> On 10/09/2014 03:31 PM, [hidden email] wrote:
>>> On 10/5/2014 10:36 AM On a whim, The Real Bev pounded out on the
>>> keyboard
>>>
>>>> On 10/05/2014 01:36 AM, Ron Hunter wrote:
>>>>> On 10/5/2014 1:19 AM, The Real Bev wrote:
>>>>>> On 10/04/2014 11:02 PM, The Real Bev wrote:
>>>>>>> On 10/04/2014 06:27 PM, responder wrote:
>>>>>>>> On 10/4/2014 7:13 PM, The Real Bev wrote:
>>>>>>>>> Suddenly, although I have 1.2 GB available in my 'phone'
>>>>>>>>>   partition and 90 MB available in my 'internal storage'
>>>>>>>>> partition, I'm told I don't have enough space to update
>>>>>>>>> ANY of the 10 or so apps that attempted to auto-update.
>>>>>>>>> I deleted an app and was told I didn't have enough space
>>>>>>>>> to even reinstall it.  A bit of searching reveals that
>>>>>>>>> this problem exists for a number of different brands of
>>>>>>>>> phones, so I conclude it's an Android glitch.
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> I did what the google website (about as inadequate for
>>>>>>>>> Android as it's possible to be) suggested (clearing the
>>>>>>>>> data and cache for play store and download manager) and
>>>>>>>>> spent at least half an hour on the phone with some nice
>>>>>>>>> google ladies who were completely unable to help because
>>>>>>>>>   they really only knew about Nexus phones, not others.
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> I'm really shocked that google sells Android to other
>>>>>>>>> manufacturers but has no OS-only help facility at all --
>>>>>>>>>   especially when there seem to be OS-related problems
>>>>>>>>> that have nothing at all to do with the hardware it's
>>>>>>>>> installed on.
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> Anyway, I'm using the scattergun approach to finding a
>>>>>>>>> solution.  I've posted into some appropriate places and
>>>>>>>>> I've emailed BLU, but they normally take a couple of days
>>>>>>>>> to respond and they'll probably tell me to do a factory
>>>>>>>>> reset -- which will probably solve the problem, but is
>>>>>>>>> clearly undesirable.
>>>>>>>> Join the crowd.
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> I have the same issues.
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> My current phone is about 8 mos old and I had to replace it
>>>>>>>> about 2 months ago for some problem that persisted, The
>>>>>>>> replacements are fine.
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> I had the original phones rooted and this solved the memory
>>>>>>>> problem. When they had to be replaced in warranty, since
>>>>>>>> rooting voids that warranty, I un-rooted them first,
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> Now, after experiencing the same situation as you, I'm
>>>>>>>> getting ready to root again.
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> Good luck..
>>>>>>> I found a notification for updating Firefox NOT through the
>>>>>>> play store. It seemed to go perfectly, but I can't remember
>>>>>>> what the old version number was.  It's now 32.0.  Is that the
>>>>>>> latest for Android?
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> If sideloading or going through other non-playstore sites
>>>>>>> works fine, that would seem to narrow it down to a playstore
>>>>>>>   problem, wouldn't it?
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> Except for the 4-GB internal memory problem (which I should
>>>>>>> have known about, except it's not publicized by the
>>>>>>> manufacturers or the reviewers, who just say the unit has an
>>>>>>>   external sdcard slot and if you want to believe that you can
>>>>>>>   run apps from it, well, that's OK with them, it's not THEIR
>>>>>>>   job to educate you) I like the BLU phone.  When the camera
>>>>>>> was bad (out of the box, no distant focus) they replaced it
>>>>>>> quickly and I think they sent me a prepaid UPS label.  I'm
>>>>>>> going to phone them Monday or Tuesday...
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> I've never seen anything about rooting this phone, so I'm not
>>>>>>> even going to consider that.
>>>>>> Addendum:  It's definitely the play store -- I just downloaded
>>>>>>   the TED .apk file, copied it to my external sd card and
>>>>>> installed it from there. No problem.  Google seems to be if not
>>>>>> actually evil a little less good than it claims to be.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Find the URL for the app you want to download -- or maybe even
>>>>>>   update, I haven't tried that yet -- and feed it into this
>>>>>> website: http://apps.evozi.com , If you're running chrome you
>>>>>> can get an extension to do it and save a step.  So far so
>>>>>> good...
>> I've been able to update using sideloading.  WOO-HOO.  Sort of.
>>
>>>>> One of the things Android phone/tablet users brag about
>>>>> (endlessly) is that their phones/tablets can expand memory by
>>>>> plugging in an SD card. Trouble is, the phone/tablet won't USE
>>>>> that memory for anything but 'external storage'.  You can't
>>>>> install some apps there, and you can't use it for 'system work
>>>>> space'.  In the end, you have a lot of memory, you can't just
>>>>> use.
>>>> Exactly right.  I can only conclude that the manufacturers and
>>>> reviewers refrain from mentioning this little detriment for obvious
>>>> reasons.  A number of people in the android newsgroup were as
>>>> shocked as I was to find out that 4GB of internal memory is all
>>>> that you can actually use.
>>>>
>>>> That being said, I searched the entire device for TED and found
>>>> only the file on my external card.  Either it's actually running
>>>> from the card (apparently this is something that the writers of
>>>> apps can control, which makes me wonder why they don't ALL do this)
>>>> or it installed into some area I can't see.  I've found various
>>>> installed files for other apps before, so perhaps the TED guy did
>>>> something extraordinary.
>>>>
>>>> Osmand and Co-Pilot can store their maps on the external card;
>>>> osmand gives you this choice within the UI, but Co-Pilot requires
>>>> that you edit an .ini-type file, the instructions for which I found
>>>> on line SOMEWHERE.
>> It's no longer there, but I have a 405K pdf file which I'll be happy to
>> email to anyone who wants it.
>>
>>>>> At least on my iPhone, the free memory can always be used, and I
>>>>>   don't have to go and delete apps in order to update other apps.
>>>>>   There are some ugly 'features' that are hidden behind the hype,
>>>>>   in both OSs, but I have come to really dislike the Android (4.1)
>>>>>   OS.
>>>> If I'd known I probably would have bought something with maybe 32
>>>> gb of internal memory, but maybe not -- they're too expensive.
>>>>
>>>> BLU makes a phone with more internal memory AND a slot for a card.
>>>>   If BLU figures this is a warranty problem (warranty is almost up)
>>>>   maybe I can swap this phone for the better one by paying the
>>>> difference.  Or not.
>> Nope.  They just say I should do a factory reset.
>>
>>>> What gripes me is that I've got something like $45 in credit at
>>>> the google play store which I don't think I can access by
>>>> sideloading. I've only found a few apps I was willing to pay for,
>>>> but still...
>>> Maybe you too have an Android 4.1 device like Ron?  Since 4.2, this
>>> has been possible.
>>> https://play.google.com/store/apps/details?id=com.a0soft.gphone.app2sd&hl=en
>>>
>>>
>>> And there is a simple way to force move apps for those that choose
>>> to.
>>> http://techgage.com/article/moving_your_non-movable_android_apps_to_an_sd_card/
>>>
>> 4.2.1.
>>
>> I tried the first.  I've saved the second, but (a) I have to become
>> familiar enough with windows to do what needs to be done; and (b) I
>> suspect that that will have the same limitation as the first.
>>
>> My phone refers to internal memory as "sdcard".  It has less space
>> available than what's called "phone" and is far more critical regarding
>> an acceptable level of free space.  If the 'sdcard' falls below ~70 MB
>> (out of 1 GB) I'm notified that I don't have enough space to do stuff
>> (like download email, for instance) even though I still have over 1 GB
>> of space in the
>> "phone" area.
>>
>> Accordingly, the ability to move stuff to the 'sdcard' is useless;  the
>> damn thing is nearly full and I've moved as much as possible to the
>> 'phone' area.  I would really like to be able to sort the apps by phone
>> or sdcard location so I wouldn't have to trial-and-error the process
>> when I need more 'sdcard' space.
>>
>> Perhaps the second place will tell me how to substitute /sdcard1 for
>> sdcard, in which case it might be useful;  just moving
>> otherwise-immobile apps to the 'sdcard' is useless.
>>
>> My current problem is that the Play Store has become unusable.  In every
>> instance it tells me there is not enough space to install or update an
>> app, even though I deleted FIVE apps in order to free up enough space.
>> I can download an app to my computer using
>> http://apps.evozi.com/apk-downloader/?id=com.ted.android (which for some
>> reason now wants Chrome instead of Firefox) or
>> http://market.1mobile.com/?from=new_version and sideload it to my phone
>> with no space problem whatsoever.
>>
>> I can't fix the play store app(s).  I have emailed both BLU and google
>> asking them to email me the .apk files necessary to do this.  Otherwise
>> I will have to do a backup and factory reset, a process which is highly
>> undesirable due to the fact that I have to add in all the passwords and
>> personalizations by hand.  Yes, I've done that.  I hated it.
>>
>> The reason I'm even considering it is that there are a number of pay
>> apps I'd like to have (co-pilot voice direction, for one) that I have
>> $45 worth of credit for.  I'm hoping that BLU and google come through
>> with a fix.
>>
> The memory use area is one in which iOS has a very definite advantage.
> No such problems worrying about where things need to go, of if you have
> enough memory of a certain type.  It does a great job managing memory.
> Where Android phones seem to be up to 3GB internal memory, the iOS
> machines are still doing just fine with 1GB.  Better memory management,
> or better hardware/firmware architecture?  I don't know, but whatever it
> is that requires I delete apps in order to be able to update current
> ones might well be a factor in Apple's ecology being more successful.
>

You need to be able to compare current versions of Android because
that's not the case, and not what version you have, what, 4.1?




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Re: OT -- Android 4.2.1 nastiness

F1Com
In reply to this post by The Real Bev
On 10/17/2014 1:04 PM On a whim, The Real Bev pounded out on the keyboard

> The amount of internal memory is the most important thing.  What's the
> least an iProduct has?  I bet it's more than 4 GB.
>
> It's really stupid for me to obsess over this.  I should just buy a
> Samsung phone with 32 GB of memory and stop worrying.  Unfortunately, I
> am incapable of throwing away a still-useful $150 item in order to buy a
> better $500 item :-(
>
> I really don't want an iProduct.  Even without the premium price, the
> illusion of eliteness is disgusting.
>

+1



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Re: OT -- Android 4.2.1 nastiness

The Real Bev
In reply to this post by F1Com
On 10/18/2014 05:48 PM, [hidden email] wrote:

> On 10/13/2014 1:48 PM On a whim, The Real Bev pounded out on the keyboard
>
>> On 10/09/2014 03:31 PM, [hidden email] wrote:
>>> Maybe you too have an Android 4.1 device like Ron?  Since 4.2, this
>>> has been possible.
>>> https://play.google.com/store/apps/details?id=com.a0soft.gphone.app2sd&hl=en
>>>
>>> And there is a simple way to force move apps for those that choose
>>> to.
>>> http://techgage.com/article/moving_your_non-movable_android_apps_to_an_sd_card/
>>
>> 4.2.1.
>>
>> I tried the first.  I've saved the second, but (a) I have to become
>> familiar enough with windows to do what needs to be done; and (b) I
>> suspect that that will have the same limitation as the first.
>>
>> My phone refers to internal memory as "sdcard".  It has less space
>> available than what's called "phone" and is far more critical regarding
>> an acceptable level of free space.  If the 'sdcard' falls below ~70 MB
>> (out of 1 GB) I'm notified that I don't have enough space to do stuff
>> (like download email, for instance) even though I still have over 1 GB
>> of space in the
>> "phone" area.
>>
>> Accordingly, the ability to move stuff to the 'sdcard' is useless;  the
>> damn thing is nearly full and I've moved as much as possible to the
>> 'phone' area.  I would really like to be able to sort the apps by phone
>> or sdcard location so I wouldn't have to trial-and-error the process
>> when I need more 'sdcard' space.
>>
>> Perhaps the second place will tell me how to substitute /sdcard1 for
>> sdcard, in which case it might be useful;  just moving
>> otherwise-immobile apps to the 'sdcard' is useless.
>>
>> My current problem is that the Play Store has become unusable.  In every
>> instance it tells me there is not enough space to install or update an
>> app, even though I deleted FIVE apps in order to free up enough space.
>> I can download an app to my computer using
>> http://apps.evozi.com/apk-downloader/?id=com.ted.android (which for some
>> reason now wants Chrome instead of Firefox) or
>> http://market.1mobile.com/?from=new_version and sideload it to my phone
>> with no space problem whatsoever.
>>
>> I can't fix the play store app(s).  I have emailed both BLU and google
>> asking them to email me the .apk files necessary to do this.  Otherwise
>> I will have to do a backup and factory reset, a process which is highly
>> undesirable due to the fact that I have to add in all the passwords and
>> personalizations by hand.  Yes, I've done that.  I hated it.
>>
>> The reason I'm even considering it is that there are a number of pay
>> apps I'd like to have (co-pilot voice direction, for one) that I have
>> $45 worth of credit for.  I'm hoping that BLU and google come through
>> with a fix.
>
> The limitation I doubt is Android, it must be something on your phone.
> No problems on a Nexus 5, HTC, or Samsung X5.

It's clearly something wonky with the play store.  I can install apps
with 1mobile.com and sideload with something else with no problem, but
the play store still says I don't have enough memory.  I tried to update
that by sideloading, but it didn't work.

Neither google nor BLU bothered to respond, so I'm just waiting for the
guts to do a reset/reinstall.  I never regarded that as a proper
solution to a windows problem either, but I had a bit more control there
-- with android I'm helpless.



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Re: OT -- Android 4.2.1 nastiness

The Real Bev
In reply to this post by Ron Hunter
On 10/17/2014 05:48 PM, Ron Hunter wrote:

> On 10/17/2014 3:04 PM, The Real Bev wrote:
>> On 10/13/2014 05:49 PM, Ron Hunter wrote:
>>> On 10/13/2014 3:48 PM, The Real Bev wrote:
>>>> On 10/09/2014 03:31 PM, [hidden email] wrote:
>>>>> On 10/5/2014 10:36 AM On a whim, The Real Bev pounded out on the
>>>>> keyboard
>>>>>
>>>>>> On 10/05/2014 01:36 AM, Ron Hunter wrote:
>>>>>>> On 10/5/2014 1:19 AM, The Real Bev wrote:
>>>>>>>> On 10/04/2014 11:02 PM, The Real Bev wrote:
>>>>>>>>> On 10/04/2014 06:27 PM, responder wrote:
>>>>>>>>>> On 10/4/2014 7:13 PM, The Real Bev wrote:
>>>>>>>>>>> Suddenly, although I have 1.2 GB available in my 'phone'
>>>>>>>>>>>  partition and 90 MB available in my 'internal storage'
>>>>>>>>>>> partition, I'm told I don't have enough space to update
>>>>>>>>>>> ANY of the 10 or so apps that attempted to auto-update.
>>>>>>>>>>> I deleted an app and was told I didn't have enough space
>>>>>>>>>>> to even reinstall it.  A bit of searching reveals that
>>>>>>>>>>> this problem exists for a number of different brands of
>>>>>>>>>>> phones, so I conclude it's an Android glitch.
>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>> I did what the google website (about as inadequate for
>>>>>>>>>>> Android as it's possible to be) suggested (clearing the
>>>>>>>>>>> data and cache for play store and download manager) and
>>>>>>>>>>> spent at least half an hour on the phone with some nice
>>>>>>>>>>> google ladies who were completely unable to help because
>>>>>>>>>>>  they really only knew about Nexus phones, not others.
>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>> I'm really shocked that google sells Android to other
>>>>>>>>>>> manufacturers but has no OS-only help facility at all --
>>>>>>>>>>>  especially when there seem to be OS-related problems
>>>>>>>>>>> that have nothing at all to do with the hardware it's
>>>>>>>>>>> installed on.
>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>> Anyway, I'm using the scattergun approach to finding a
>>>>>>>>>>> solution.  I've posted into some appropriate places and
>>>>>>>>>>> I've emailed BLU, but they normally take a couple of days
>>>>>>>>>>> to respond and they'll probably tell me to do a factory
>>>>>>>>>>> reset -- which will probably solve the problem, but is
>>>>>>>>>>> clearly undesirable.
>>>>>>>>>> Join the crowd.
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>> I have the same issues.
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>> My current phone is about 8 mos old and I had to replace it
>>>>>>>>>> about 2 months ago for some problem that persisted, The
>>>>>>>>>> replacements are fine.
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>> I had the original phones rooted and this solved the memory
>>>>>>>>>> problem. When they had to be replaced in warranty, since
>>>>>>>>>> rooting voids that warranty, I un-rooted them first,
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>> Now, after experiencing the same situation as you, I'm
>>>>>>>>>> getting ready to root again.
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>> Good luck..
>>>>>>>>> I found a notification for updating Firefox NOT through the
>>>>>>>>> play store. It seemed to go perfectly, but I can't remember
>>>>>>>>> what the old version number was.  It's now 32.0.  Is that the
>>>>>>>>> latest for Android?
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> If sideloading or going through other non-playstore sites
>>>>>>>>> works fine, that would seem to narrow it down to a playstore
>>>>>>>>>  problem, wouldn't it?
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> Except for the 4-GB internal memory problem (which I should
>>>>>>>>> have known about, except it's not publicized by the
>>>>>>>>> manufacturers or the reviewers, who just say the unit has an
>>>>>>>>>  external sdcard slot and if you want to believe that you can
>>>>>>>>>  run apps from it, well, that's OK with them, it's not THEIR
>>>>>>>>>  job to educate you) I like the BLU phone.  When the camera
>>>>>>>>> was bad (out of the box, no distant focus) they replaced it
>>>>>>>>> quickly and I think they sent me a prepaid UPS label.  I'm
>>>>>>>>> going to phone them Monday or Tuesday...
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> I've never seen anything about rooting this phone, so I'm not
>>>>>>>>> even going to consider that.
>>>>>>>> Addendum:  It's definitely the play store -- I just downloaded
>>>>>>>>  the TED .apk file, copied it to my external sd card and
>>>>>>>> installed it from there. No problem.  Google seems to be if not
>>>>>>>> actually evil a little less good than it claims to be.
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> Find the URL for the app you want to download -- or maybe even
>>>>>>>>  update, I haven't tried that yet -- and feed it into this
>>>>>>>> website: http://apps.evozi.com , If you're running chrome you
>>>>>>>> can get an extension to do it and save a step.  So far so
>>>>>>>> good...
>>>>
>>>> I've been able to update using sideloading.  WOO-HOO.  Sort of.
>>>>
>>>>>>> One of the things Android phone/tablet users brag about
>>>>>>> (endlessly) is that their phones/tablets can expand memory by
>>>>>>> plugging in an SD card. Trouble is, the phone/tablet won't USE
>>>>>>> that memory for anything but 'external storage'.  You can't
>>>>>>> install some apps there, and you can't use it for 'system work
>>>>>>> space'.  In the end, you have a lot of memory, you can't just
>>>>>>> use.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Exactly right.  I can only conclude that the manufacturers and
>>>>>> reviewers refrain from mentioning this little detriment for obvious
>>>>>> reasons.  A number of people in the android newsgroup were as
>>>>>> shocked as I was to find out that 4GB of internal memory is all
>>>>>> that you can actually use.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> That being said, I searched the entire device for TED and found
>>>>>> only the file on my external card.  Either it's actually running
>>>>>> from the card (apparently this is something that the writers of
>>>>>> apps can control, which makes me wonder why they don't ALL do this)
>>>>>> or it installed into some area I can't see.  I've found various
>>>>>> installed files for other apps before, so perhaps the TED guy did
>>>>>> something extraordinary.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Osmand and Co-Pilot can store their maps on the external card;
>>>>>> osmand gives you this choice within the UI, but Co-Pilot requires
>>>>>> that you edit an .ini-type file, the instructions for which I found
>>>>>> on line SOMEWHERE.
>>>>
>>>> It's no longer there, but I have a 405K pdf file which I'll be happy to
>>>> email to anyone who wants it.
>>>>
>>>>>>> At least on my iPhone, the free memory can always be used, and I
>>>>>>>  don't have to go and delete apps in order to update other apps.
>>>>>>>  There are some ugly 'features' that are hidden behind the hype,
>>>>>>>  in both OSs, but I have come to really dislike the Android (4.1)
>>>>>>>  OS.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> If I'd known I probably would have bought something with maybe 32
>>>>>> gb of internal memory, but maybe not -- they're too expensive.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> BLU makes a phone with more internal memory AND a slot for a card.
>>>>>>  If BLU figures this is a warranty problem (warranty is almost up)
>>>>>>  maybe I can swap this phone for the better one by paying the
>>>>>> difference.  Or not.
>>>>
>>>> Nope.  They just say I should do a factory reset.
>>>>
>>>>>> What gripes me is that I've got something like $45 in credit at
>>>>>> the google play store which I don't think I can access by
>>>>>> sideloading. I've only found a few apps I was willing to pay for,
>>>>>> but still...
>>>>>
>>>>> Maybe you too have an Android 4.1 device like Ron?  Since 4.2, this
>>>>> has been possible.
>>>>> https://play.google.com/store/apps/details?id=com.a0soft.gphone.app2sd&hl=en
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>> And there is a simple way to force move apps for those that choose
>>>>> to.
>>>>> http://techgage.com/article/moving_your_non-movable_android_apps_to_an_sd_card/
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>
>>>> 4.2.1.
>>>>
>>>> I tried the first.  I've saved the second, but (a) I have to become
>>>> familiar enough with windows to do what needs to be done; and (b) I
>>>> suspect that that will have the same limitation as the first.
>>>>
>>>> My phone refers to internal memory as "sdcard".  It has less space
>>>> available than what's called "phone" and is far more critical regarding
>>>> an acceptable level of free space.  If the 'sdcard' falls below ~70 MB
>>>> (out of 1 GB) I'm notified that I don't have enough space to do stuff
>>>> (like download email, for instance) even though I still have over 1 GB
>>>> of space in the
>>>> "phone" area.
>>>>
>>>> Accordingly, the ability to move stuff to the 'sdcard' is useless;  the
>>>> damn thing is nearly full and I've moved as much as possible to the
>>>> 'phone' area.  I would really like to be able to sort the apps by phone
>>>> or sdcard location so I wouldn't have to trial-and-error the process
>>>> when I need more 'sdcard' space.
>>>>
>>>> Perhaps the second place will tell me how to substitute /sdcard1 for
>>>> sdcard, in which case it might be useful;  just moving
>>>> otherwise-immobile apps to the 'sdcard' is useless.
>>>>
>>>> My current problem is that the Play Store has become unusable.  In every
>>>> instance it tells me there is not enough space to install or update an
>>>> app, even though I deleted FIVE apps in order to free up enough space.
>>>> I can download an app to my computer using
>>>> http://apps.evozi.com/apk-downloader/?id=com.ted.android (which for some
>>>> reason now wants Chrome instead of Firefox) or
>>>> http://market.1mobile.com/?from=new_version and sideload it to my phone
>>>> with no space problem whatsoever.
>>>>
>>>> I can't fix the play store app(s).  I have emailed both BLU and google
>>>> asking them to email me the .apk files necessary to do this.  Otherwise
>>>> I will have to do a backup and factory reset, a process which is highly
>>>> undesirable due to the fact that I have to add in all the passwords and
>>>> personalizations by hand.  Yes, I've done that.  I hated it.
>>>>
>>>> The reason I'm even considering it is that there are a number of pay
>>>> apps I'd like to have (co-pilot voice direction, for one) that I have
>>>> $45 worth of credit for.  I'm hoping that BLU and google come through
>>>> with a fix.
>>>>
>>> The memory use area is one in which iOS has a very definite advantage.
>>> No such problems worrying about where things need to go, of if you have
>>> enough memory of a certain type.  It does a great job managing memory.
>>> Where Android phones seem to be up to 3GB internal memory, the iOS
>>> machines are still doing just fine with 1GB.  Better memory management,
>>> or better hardware/firmware architecture?  I don't know, but whatever it
>>> is that requires I delete apps in order to be able to update current
>>> ones might well be a factor in Apple's ecology being more successful.
>>
>> The amount of internal memory is the most important thing.  What's the
>> least an iProduct has?  I bet it's more than 4 GB.
>>
>> It's really stupid for me to obsess over this.  I should just buy a
>> Samsung phone with 32 GB of memory and stop worrying.  Unfortunately, I
>> am incapable of throwing away a still-useful $150 item in order to buy a
>> better $500 item :-(
>>
>> I really don't want an iProduct.  Even without the premium price, the
>> illusion of eliteness is disgusting.
>>
> Illusion of eliteness?  What an irrelevant reason to not buy a device.

No, it's not.  The smugness of iPeople (present company excepted, of
course) is bothersome, but not as bothersome as the fact that iStuff is
more expensive in terms of what's available for non-iStuff AND that
you're locked into buying ONLY iStuff.  The whole thing is the
equivalent of fingernails on a blackboard.

> It seems to me that memory management is very good on the iPhone, as I
> have only 1 GB of memory, but even after days and days of use, I find I
> have 363 MB of RAM available, even with the monitor app loaded.
> Meanwhile, with NOTHING running on the Android tablet, same RAM, I have
> 162 MB available, which is often not enough to update a large program.

Until this nastiness happened I was coping.  There are apps I'd like,
but not enough to trade something else for them.  Now that I've moved my
co-pilot maps to the external sd card I've got enough space for a few
more...as soon as I do the reset.  I'm really dreading doing that again.

> And, Apple fixes bugs, and distributes the fixed OS free, to just about
> any device with the necessary hardware.  That was the point which tipped
> me over to the iPhone.

I'm sure you had good reasons, but I simply can't do it.  Look upon it
as a religious thing :-)


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=====================================================================
"The danger to America is not Barack Obama but a citizenry capable of
entrusting a man like him with the presidency. It will be easier to limit
and undo the follies of an Obama presidency than to restore the necessary
common sense and good judgment to a depraved electorate willing to have
such a man for their president. The problem is much deeper and far more
serious than Mr. Obama, who is a mere symptom of what ails them. Blaming
the prince of the fools should not blind anyone to the vast confederacy of
fools that made him their prince. The republic can survive a Barack Obama,
who is, after all, merely a fool. It is less likely to survive a multitude
of fools such as those who made him their president."      -- Unknown
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