Newsgroups are the Purest Form of WWW Communication, Still

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Newsgroups are the Purest Form of WWW Communication, Still

Erness Wild
In my opinion: newsgroups are still the purest form of communication on
the www.
Like a crowd gathering in a market square and talking to each other.
Only the market square is the world and talking is typing, in a form
that produces archives, which make good reference for future reading.


--
Takes more than talk to get things done.
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Re: Newsgroups are the Purest Form of WWW Communication, Still

Jim Hawkins-2

"Erness Wild" <[hidden email]> wrote in message
news:[hidden email]...
> In my opinion: newsgroups are still the purest form of communication on
> the www.
> Like a crowd gathering in a market square and talking to each other. Only
> the market square is the world and talking is typing, in a form that
> produces archives, which make good reference for future reading.


The market square has the police to keep the local yobs, loons,
loudmouths, psychotics and general nutcases under control.
Unfortunately, only a few newsgroups that have an
effective moderator manage to keep the riffraff out and aspire
to anything like civilized conversation.

Jim Hawkins



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Re: Newsgroups are the Purest Form of WWW Communication, Still

David E. Ross-3
In reply to this post by Erness Wild
On 1/3/2014 5:12 AM, Erness Wild wrote:
> In my opinion: newsgroups are still the purest form of communication on
> the www.
> Like a crowd gathering in a market square and talking to each other.
> Only the market square is the world and talking is typing, in a form
> that produces archives, which make good reference for future reading.
>
>

Note that the Big-8, Usenet, and the other hierarchies of newsgroups are
NOT part of the World-Wide Web (WWW).  Newsgroups are part of the
Internet separate from the WWW.  (This was brought to my attention by
another member of the Big8-Usenet Board.)

Because of threading and independence of any one host, I much prefer
newsgroups over Web-based forums.

--
David E. Ross
<http://www.rossde.com/>

Anything I post in this newsgroup is my personal
opinion and does not reflect the official position
of the Big8-Usenet Board.
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Re: Newsgroups are the Purest Form of WWW Communication, Still

PhillipJones-2
In reply to this post by Erness Wild
Erness Wild wrote:
> In my opinion: newsgroups are still the purest form of communication on
> the www.
> Like a crowd gathering in a market square and talking to each other.
> Only the market square is the world and talking is typing, in a form
> that produces archives, which make good reference for future reading.
>
>

Agreed. To this day despite My participation on several Support Forums,
(Acrobat Users [Expert], Adobe Forums For Acrobat, Microsoft Office for
Mac [Mcc]), I still hate the concept. Its not personal like Newsgroups.
And despite what Chris I says. When You newsgroup its like a Group friends.

According to him: "if I want a Friend I go to a bar. When I am on
computer its all business I don't care about anybody on the computer"

--
Phillip M. Jones, C.E.T.      "If it's Fixed, Don't Break it"
http://www.phillipmjones.net    mailto:[hidden email]
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Re: Newsgroups are the Purest Form of WWW Communication, Still

PhillipJones-2
In reply to this post by David E. Ross-3
David E. Ross wrote:

> On 1/3/2014 5:12 AM, Erness Wild wrote:
>> In my opinion: newsgroups are still the purest form of communication on
>> the www.
>> Like a crowd gathering in a market square and talking to each other.
>> Only the market square is the world and talking is typing, in a form
>> that produces archives, which make good reference for future reading.
>>
>>
>
> Note that the Big-8, Usenet, and the other hierarchies of newsgroups are
> NOT part of the World-Wide Web (WWW).  Newsgroups are part of the
> Internet separate from the WWW.  (This was brought to my attention by
> another member of the Big8-Usenet Board.)
>
> Because of threading and independence of any one host, I much prefer
> newsgroups over Web-based forums.
>
News groups are actually part of USENET Regardless of whether the Group
is Mozilla or not. Mozilla *is* part of USENET.

--
Phillip M. Jones, C.E.T.      "If it's Fixed, Don't Break it"
http://www.phillipmjones.net    mailto:[hidden email]
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Re: Newsgroups are the Purest Form of WWW Communication, Still

PhillipJones-2
In reply to this post by David E. Ross-3
David E. Ross wrote:

> On 1/3/2014 5:12 AM, Erness Wild wrote:
>> In my opinion: newsgroups are still the purest form of communication on
>> the www.
>> Like a crowd gathering in a market square and talking to each other.
>> Only the market square is the world and talking is typing, in a form
>> that produces archives, which make good reference for future reading.
>>
>>
>
> Note that the Big-8, Usenet, and the other hierarchies of newsgroups are
> NOT part of the World-Wide Web (WWW).  Newsgroups are part of the
> Internet separate from the WWW.  (This was brought to my attention by
> another member of the Big8-Usenet Board.)
>
> Because of threading and independence of any one host, I much prefer
> newsgroups over Web-based forums.
>

Forums are www they work strictly using a Web Browser. In between USENET
and Forums were Bulletin Boards. They used software such as Red-Ryder,
White-Knight. They were pre-cursor to newsgroups. At that point USENET
was "mostly" used for the armed services for communications, before it
was released to the general public.

--
Phillip M. Jones, C.E.T.      "If it's Fixed, Don't Break it"
http://www.phillipmjones.net    mailto:[hidden email]
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Re: Newsgroups are the Purest Form of WWW Communication, Still

J. P. Gilliver (John)
In message <[hidden email]>, PhillipJones
<[hidden email]> writes:
[]
>Forums are www they work strictly using a Web Browser. In between
>USENET and Forums were Bulletin Boards. They used software such as
>Red-Ryder, White-Knight. They were pre-cursor to newsgroups. At that
>point USENET was "mostly" used for the armed services for
>communications, before it was released to the general public.
>
Pre-cursor, pre-mice altogether ... even pre-CRT (-:!
--
J. P. Gilliver. UMRA: 1960/<1985 MB++G()AL-IS-Ch++(p)Ar@T+H+Sh0!:`)DNAf

The early worm gets the bird.
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Re: Newsgroups are the Purest Form of WWW Communication, Still

»Q«
In reply to this post by David E. Ross-3
In <news:[hidden email]>,
"David E. Ross" <[hidden email]> wrote:

> On 1/3/2014 5:12 AM, Erness Wild wrote:
> > In my opinion: newsgroups are still the purest form of
> > communication on the www.
> > Like a crowd gathering in a market square and talking to each
> > other. Only the market square is the world and talking is typing,
> > in a form that produces archives, which make good reference for
> > future reading.
>
> Note that the Big-8, Usenet, and the other hierarchies of newsgroups
> are NOT part of the World-Wide Web (WWW).  Newsgroups are part of the
> Internet separate from the WWW.  (This was brought to my attention by
> another member of the Big8-Usenet Board.)

Originally, Usenet wasn't even part of the Internet;  it used UUCP over
dial-up connections between machines.  Only with the switch to NNTP
over TCP/IP could it really be said to be part of the Internet.  I
believe that transition occurred before the Great Renaming that
established the Big 8 hierarchies

Since web interfaces for both reading and posting to Usenet have
existed for many years, I'd argue that Usenet is *not* separate from
the WWW any more.

> Because of threading and independence of any one host, I much prefer
> newsgroups over Web-based forums.

For those and other reasons, I do too.  Chief among the other reasons
is client-side filtering.

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Re: Newsgroups are the Purest Form of WWW Communication, Still

»Q«
In reply to this post by PhillipJones-2
In <news:[hidden email]>,
PhillipJones <[hidden email]> wrote:

> News groups are actually part of USENET Regardless of whether the
> Group is Mozilla or not. Mozilla *is* part of USENET.

That's incorrect.  Usenet consists of a bunch of peer servers which
exchange posts with each other.  news.mozilla.org does not peer with
those servers;  it isn't part of Usenet.

The umbrella term for systems which use NNTP, including Usenet and
n.m.o and many other systems, is "netnews", a shortening of the
protocol name.
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Re: Newsgroups are the Purest Form of WWW Communication, Still

»Q«
In reply to this post by PhillipJones-2
In <news:[hidden email]>,
PhillipJones <[hidden email]> wrote:

> Forums are www they work strictly using a Web Browser. In between
> USENET and Forums were Bulletin Boards. They used software such as
> Red-Ryder, White-Knight. They were pre-cursor to newsgroups. At that
> point USENET was "mostly" used for the armed services for
> communications, before it was released to the general public.

No, Usenet was *never* mostly used for armed services communication.
It started at UNC and Duke, and for years it was mostly used by people
at academic institutions.

The Internet, which was separate from Usenet back then, has its roots
in ARPANET, which was developed by the military;  maybe that's what you
were thinking of?
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Re: Newsgroups are the Purest Form of WWW Communication, Still

»Q«
In reply to this post by PhillipJones-2
In <news:[hidden email]>,
PhillipJones <[hidden email]> wrote:

> Forums are www they work strictly using a Web Browser. In between
> USENET and Forums were Bulletin Boards. They used software such as
> Red-Ryder, White-Knight. They were pre-cursor to newsgroups. At that
> point USENET was "mostly" used for the armed services for
> communications, before it was released to the general public.

No, Usenet was *never* mostly used for armed services communication.
It started at UNC and Duke, and for years it was mostly used by people
at academic institutions.

The Internet, which was separate from Usenet back then, has its roots
in ARPANET, which was developed by the military;  maybe that's what you
were thinking of?
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Re: Newsgroups are the Purest Form of WWW Communication, Still

PhillipJones-2
In reply to this post by J. P. Gilliver (John)
J. P. Gilliver (John) wrote:

> In message <[hidden email]>, PhillipJones
> <[hidden email]> writes:
> []
>> Forums are www they work strictly using a Web Browser. In between
>> USENET and Forums were Bulletin Boards. They used software such as
>> Red-Ryder, White-Knight. They were pre-cursor to newsgroups. At that
>> point USENET was "mostly" used for the armed services for
>> communications, before it was released to the general public.
>>
> Pre-cursor, pre-mice altogether ... even pre-CRT (-:!
Yep you right pre-mice, pre-CRT.

--
Phillip M. Jones, C.E.T.      "If it's Fixed, Don't Break it"
http://www.phillipmjones.net    mailto:[hidden email]
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Re: Newsgroups are the Purest Form of WWW Communication, Still

PhillipJones-2
In reply to this post by »Q«
»Q« wrote:

> In <news:[hidden email]>,
> PhillipJones <[hidden email]> wrote:
>
>> Forums are www they work strictly using a Web Browser. In between
>> USENET and Forums were Bulletin Boards. They used software such as
>> Red-Ryder, White-Knight. They were pre-cursor to newsgroups. At that
>> point USENET was "mostly" used for the armed services for
>> communications, before it was released to the general public.
>
> No, Usenet was *never* mostly used for armed services communication.
> It started at UNC and Duke, and for years it was mostly used by people
> at academic institutions.
>
> The Internet, which was separate from Usenet back then, has its roots
> in ARPANET, which was developed by the military;  maybe that's what you
> were thinking of?
>
That sounds about right.

--
Phillip M. Jones, C.E.T.      "If it's Fixed, Don't Break it"
http://www.phillipmjones.net    mailto:[hidden email]
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Re: Newsgroups are the Purest Form of WWW Communication, Still

Ron Hunter
In reply to this post by J. P. Gilliver (John)
On 1/3/2014 7:24 PM, J. P. Gilliver (John) wrote:

> In message <[hidden email]>, PhillipJones
> <[hidden email]> writes:
> []
>> Forums are www they work strictly using a Web Browser. In between
>> USENET and Forums were Bulletin Boards. They used software such as
>> Red-Ryder, White-Knight. They were pre-cursor to newsgroups. At that
>> point USENET was "mostly" used for the armed services for
>> communications, before it was released to the general public.
>>
> Pre-cursor, pre-mice altogether ... even pre-CRT (-:!
Pre CRT?  I recall the color TV was invented in 1939 or there-abouts.  I
doubt the 'pre-CRT' thing.

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Re: Newsgroups are the Purest Form of WWW Communication, Still

J. P. Gilliver (John)
In message <[hidden email]>, Ron Hunter
<[hidden email]> writes:

>On 1/3/2014 7:24 PM, J. P. Gilliver (John) wrote:
>> In message <[hidden email]>, PhillipJones
>> <[hidden email]> writes:
>> []
>>> Forums are www they work strictly using a Web Browser. In between
>>> USENET and Forums were Bulletin Boards. They used software such as
>>> Red-Ryder, White-Knight. They were pre-cursor to newsgroups. At that
>>> point USENET was "mostly" used for the armed services for
>>> communications, before it was released to the general public.
>>>
>> Pre-cursor, pre-mice altogether ... even pre-CRT (-:!
>Pre CRT?  I recall the color TV was invented in 1939 or there-abouts. I
>doubt the 'pre-CRT' thing.
>
Sorry, I was only making a feeble joke based on PJ's insertion of a
hyphen into the word "precursor". And yes, I'm sure you're right about
CRTs - I think they may even date from 19C ... yes, Wikipedia puts it at
1897 (for the one with a phosphor, anyway). I meant their use in
computing - and before anyone jumps on _that_ one, yes I know Colossus
had some sort of CRT-based memory, I meant their use in communication
terminals, i. e. when teletypes were the norm. (I _think_ I remember
reading usenet in that way, at UKC [England]; I certainly remember using
such paper-based terminals for some things, though they were on the way
out then [around 1980].)
--
J. P. Gilliver. UMRA: 1960/<1985 MB++G()AL-IS-Ch++(p)Ar@T+H+Sh0!:`)DNAf

Quantity is no substitute for quality, but it's the only one we've got.
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Re: Newsgroups are the Purest Form of WWW Communication, Still

PhillipJones-2
In reply to this post by Ron Hunter
Ron Hunter wrote:

> On 1/3/2014 7:24 PM, J. P. Gilliver (John) wrote:
>> In message <[hidden email]>, PhillipJones
>> <[hidden email]> writes:
>> []
>>> Forums are www they work strictly using a Web Browser. In between
>>> USENET and Forums were Bulletin Boards. They used software such as
>>> Red-Ryder, White-Knight. They were pre-cursor to newsgroups. At that
>>> point USENET was "mostly" used for the armed services for
>>> communications, before it was released to the general public.
>>>
>> Pre-cursor, pre-mice altogether ... even pre-CRT (-:!
> Pre CRT?  I recall the color TV was invented in 1939 or there-abouts.  I
> doubt the 'pre-CRT' thing.
>
Invented in 1939 actually massed produced, in any real number in the
early 50's

--
Phillip M. Jones, C.E.T.      "If it's Fixed, Don't Break it"
http://www.phillipmjones.net    mailto:[hidden email]
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Re: Newsgroups are the Purest Form of WWW Communication, Still

PhillipJones-2
In reply to this post by Ron Hunter
Ron Hunter wrote:

> On 1/3/2014 7:24 PM, J. P. Gilliver (John) wrote:
>> In message <[hidden email]>, PhillipJones
>> <[hidden email]> writes:
>> []
>>> Forums are www they work strictly using a Web Browser. In between
>>> USENET and Forums were Bulletin Boards. They used software such as
>>> Red-Ryder, White-Knight. They were pre-cursor to newsgroups. At that
>>> point USENET was "mostly" used for the armed services for
>>> communications, before it was released to the general public.
>>>
>> Pre-cursor, pre-mice altogether ... even pre-CRT (-:!
> Pre CRT?  I recall the color TV was invented in 1939 or there-abouts.  I
> doubt the 'pre-CRT' thing.
>

A Great uncle of mine had the the very first ever Color TV in Henry
County Va in 1952. He was a Supervisor in a Manufacturing Plant and the
TV cost twice as much as his new Car. Everyone in his neighborhood would
come to watch  the Lone Ranger, any Color show they had available. My
most memorable memory of the set was an western in color, Indians would
look so red, it look like blood was dripping from their faces/bodies.
(To this day I can not abide excessive color on a Color TV. I want
people faces look as close to their natural color as possible even if it
means that greenery such as grass and leaves look dull looking.) and I
noticed on commercials even though you didn't touch the volume, were 4
to 5 times loud than the actual show. Thankfully the Federal government
after years of complaints put the kibosh on that practice.

--
Phillip M. Jones, C.E.T.      "If it's Fixed, Don't Break it"
http://www.phillipmjones.net    mailto:[hidden email]
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Re: Newsgroups are the Purest Form of WWW Communication, Still

RAV-2
On 1/4/2014 5:36 PM, PhillipJones wrote:

> Ron Hunter wrote:
>> On 1/3/2014 7:24 PM, J. P. Gilliver (John) wrote:
>>> In message <[hidden email]>, PhillipJones
>>> <[hidden email]> writes:
>>> []
>>>> Forums are www they work strictly using a Web Browser. In between
>>>> USENET and Forums were Bulletin Boards. They used software such as
>>>> Red-Ryder, White-Knight. They were pre-cursor to newsgroups. At that
>>>> point USENET was "mostly" used for the armed services for
>>>> communications, before it was released to the general public.
>>>>
>>> Pre-cursor, pre-mice altogether ... even pre-CRT (-:!
>> Pre CRT?  I recall the color TV was invented in 1939 or there-abouts.  I
>> doubt the 'pre-CRT' thing.
>>
>
> A Great uncle of mine had the the very first ever Color TV in Henry
> County Va in 1952. He was a Supervisor in a Manufacturing Plant and the
> TV cost twice as much as his new Car. Everyone in his neighborhood would
> come to watch  the Lone Ranger, any Color show they had available. My
> most memorable memory of the set was an western in color, Indians would
> look so red, it look like blood was dripping from their faces/bodies.
> (To this day I can not abide excessive color on a Color TV. I want
> people faces look as close to their natural color as possible even if it
> means that greenery such as grass and leaves look dull looking.) and I
> noticed on commercials even though you didn't touch the volume, were 4
> to 5 times loud than the actual show. Thankfully the Federal government
> after years of complaints put the kibosh on that practice.
>

I remember the first time I saw the "Wizard of Oz" on a color TV (early
70s).  When they showed the "horse of a different color," I realized for
the first time that it really WAS a horse of a different color!
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Re: Newsgroups are the Purest Form of WWW Communication, Still

Ron Hunter
In reply to this post by J. P. Gilliver (John)
On 1/4/2014 11:50 AM, J. P. Gilliver (John) wrote:

> In message <[hidden email]>, Ron Hunter
> <[hidden email]> writes:
>> On 1/3/2014 7:24 PM, J. P. Gilliver (John) wrote:
>>> In message <[hidden email]>, PhillipJones
>>> <[hidden email]> writes:
>>> []
>>>> Forums are www they work strictly using a Web Browser. In between
>>>> USENET and Forums were Bulletin Boards. They used software such as
>>>> Red-Ryder, White-Knight. They were pre-cursor to newsgroups. At that
>>>> point USENET was "mostly" used for the armed services for
>>>> communications, before it was released to the general public.
>>>>
>>> Pre-cursor, pre-mice altogether ... even pre-CRT (-:!
>> Pre CRT?  I recall the color TV was invented in 1939 or there-abouts.
>> I doubt the 'pre-CRT' thing.
>>
> Sorry, I was only making a feeble joke based on PJ's insertion of a
> hyphen into the word "precursor". And yes, I'm sure you're right about
> CRTs - I think they may even date from 19C ... yes, Wikipedia puts it at
> 1897 (for the one with a phosphor, anyway). I meant their use in
> computing - and before anyone jumps on _that_ one, yes I know Colossus
> had some sort of CRT-based memory, I meant their use in communication
> terminals, i. e. when teletypes were the norm. (I _think_ I remember
> reading usenet in that way, at UKC [England]; I certainly remember using
> such paper-based terminals for some things, though they were on the way
> out then [around 1980].)
The first I saw of USENET was about 1980, on a Unix machine.

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Re: Newsgroups are the Purest Form of WWW Communication, Still

Ron Hunter
In reply to this post by PhillipJones-2
On 1/4/2014 4:36 PM, PhillipJones wrote:

> Ron Hunter wrote:
>> On 1/3/2014 7:24 PM, J. P. Gilliver (John) wrote:
>>> In message <[hidden email]>, PhillipJones
>>> <[hidden email]> writes:
>>> []
>>>> Forums are www they work strictly using a Web Browser. In between
>>>> USENET and Forums were Bulletin Boards. They used software such as
>>>> Red-Ryder, White-Knight. They were pre-cursor to newsgroups. At that
>>>> point USENET was "mostly" used for the armed services for
>>>> communications, before it was released to the general public.
>>>>
>>> Pre-cursor, pre-mice altogether ... even pre-CRT (-:!
>> Pre CRT?  I recall the color TV was invented in 1939 or there-abouts.  I
>> doubt the 'pre-CRT' thing.
>>
>
> A Great uncle of mine had the the very first ever Color TV in Henry
> County Va in 1952. He was a Supervisor in a Manufacturing Plant and the
> TV cost twice as much as his new Car. Everyone in his neighborhood would
> come to watch  the Lone Ranger, any Color show they had available. My
> most memorable memory of the set was an western in color, Indians would
> look so red, it look like blood was dripping from their faces/bodies.
> (To this day I can not abide excessive color on a Color TV. I want
> people faces look as close to their natural color as possible even if it
> means that greenery such as grass and leaves look dull looking.) and I
> noticed on commercials even though you didn't touch the volume, were 4
> to 5 times loud than the actual show. Thankfully the Federal government
> after years of complaints put the kibosh on that practice.
>
The Lone Ranger wasn't in color until MUCH later.  Some of the early
color tvs would try to make things appear to be in color by making the
upper part of the screen blue, and the lower part green, so things like
westerns might appear to have some color.
The first season shot in color was 1957, the last for the series.
http://matineeclassics.com/tv/1949/the_lone_ranger/details/

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