English: no rule for making "ing" verbs?

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English: no rule for making "ing" verbs?

Balaco
In English, is there a rule for knowing when we need or not to duplicate
the last letter of a verb, when writing it in the present participle?

Begin => beginning
Know => knowing

Every now and then I miss them. And the rule for this, that I learned in
scholl, is: "if the last letter is consonant, duplicate it". But I found
many exceptions for that, so I basically know this rule as something
that does not work. When I need it to be correct and have some doubt, I
use a dictionary - but that is a pain to do, if for everything I write,
and also sometimes unfeasible.
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Re: English: no rule for making "ing" verbs?

David E. Ross-3
On 12/7/2017 3:33 PM, Balaco wrote:

> In English, is there a rule for knowing when we need or not to duplicate
> the last letter of a verb, when writing it in the present participle?
>
> Begin => beginning
> Know => knowing
>
> Every now and then I miss them. And the rule for this, that I learned in
> scholl, is: "if the last letter is consonant, duplicate it". But I found
> many exceptions for that, so I basically know this rule as something
> that does not work. When I need it to be correct and have some doubt, I
> use a dictionary - but that is a pain to do, if for everything I write,
> and also sometimes unfeasible.
>

Unfortunately, there is no rule that is absolute.  In general, the last
letter is doubled if it is a consonant AND the letter before it is a
vowel.  However, your own example with "know" versus "knowing" shows
that this rule is not absolute.

I am a native speaker of English, born in California to parents who were
born in Chicago (all in the U.S.).  I have spoken English, written it,
and read it for over 70 years.  Yet I must often refer to a dictionary
or spell-checker to determine if I have written a word correctly.

--
David E. Ross
<http://www.rossde.com/>

President Trump:  Please stop using Twitter.  We need
to hear your voice and see you talking.  We need to know
when your message is really your own and not your attorney's.
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Re: English: no rule for making "ing" verbs?

Balaco
Em 07-12-2017 22:45, David E. Ross escreveu:

> On 12/7/2017 3:33 PM, Balaco wrote:
>> In English, is there a rule for knowing when we need or not to duplicate
>> the last letter of a verb, when writing it in the present participle?
>>
>> Begin => beginning
>> Know => knowing
>>
>> Every now and then I miss them. And the rule for this, that I learned in
>> scholl, is: "if the last letter is consonant, duplicate it". But I found
>> many exceptions for that, so I basically know this rule as something
>> that does not work. When I need it to be correct and have some doubt, I
>> use a dictionary - but that is a pain to do, if for everything I write,
>> and also sometimes unfeasible.
>>
>
> Unfortunately, there is no rule that is absolute.  In general, the last
> letter is doubled if it is a consonant AND the letter before it is a
> vowel.  However, your own example with "know" versus "knowing" shows
> that this rule is not absolute.
>
> I am a native speaker of English, born in California to parents who were
> born in Chicago (all in the U.S.).  I have spoken English, written it,
> and read it for over 70 years.  Yet I must often refer to a dictionary
> or spell-checker to determine if I have written a word correctly.
>

Actually, the rule I thought I said above (which I learned) should have
been written as "if the last letter is consonant, *and* the previous is
vowel, *and* the second previous is consonant, then duplicate".

70 is a lot of time!

Thank you for telling me these things. They are important to me.
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Re: English: no rule for making "ing" verbs?

Wolf K.
In reply to this post by Balaco
On 2017-12-07 18:33, Balaco wrote:

> In English, is there a rule for knowing when we need or not to duplicate
> the last letter of a verb, when writing it in the present participle?
>
> Begin => beginning
> Know => knowing
>
> Every now and then I miss them. And the rule for this, that I learned in
> school, is: "if the last letter is consonant, duplicate it". But I found
> many exceptions for that, so I basically know this rule as something
> that does not work. When I need it to be correct and have some doubt, I
> use a dictionary - but that is a pain to do, if for everything I write,
> and also sometimes unfeasible.

It's about long and short vowels, which in English are taught in terms
of letter names instead of sounds. Basically, if the last syllable has a
short vowel (as in pat, pet, pit, pot, put, putt), you must double the
consonant letter to signal a short vowel when adding a syllable:
begin-beginning-beginner, tap-tapping-tapper, pet-petting-petter,
spot-spotting-spotter, gun-gunning-gunner, etc.

If the vowel is long (which in most English dialects means it's a
diphthong, and/or r-coloured), you must not double the consonant (Bart,
bait, beat, boat, boot, bite, Bert, bork). Thus dine-dining, not
dinning. NB that dinner has the short /i/ (as in bit) vowel, hence the
double consonant. I sometimes see that people have a dinning room in
their homes, I guess they make a lot of noise while dining. :-)

The above will help if your native language uses the standard Latin
vowel values.

If you want to know why English spelling is such a mess, the short
answer is that England adopted printing, and hence standardised
spelling, before the transition from Late Middle English to Early Modern
English was complete. Thus many spellings record English both as spoken
ca 1450-1550 and from ca 1550 on: wind/wind, bow/bow, etc. Or gait/gate,
neither of which was pronounced as they are now.

Spelling didn't become standardised until ca 1700, but some sounds
shifted some more: tea once rimed with Tay. Also, around that time, some
spellings were deliberately changed to reflect the etymology of the
word: Debt was earlier spelled dette, for example.

And then there are the national quirks, such as the -ise/-ize or
-or/-our differences between UK and US spelling.

I know this doesn't help as much as you and I would like. :-)

--
Wolf K
kirkwood40.blogspot.com
"The next conference for the time travel design team will be held two
weeks ago."
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Re: English: no rule for making "ing" verbs?

Balaco
Em 07-12-2017 23:36, Wolf K escreveu:

> On 2017-12-07 18:33, Balaco wrote:
>> In English, is there a rule for knowing when we need or not to
>> duplicate the last letter of a verb, when writing it in the present
>> participle?
>>
>> Begin => beginning
>> Know => knowing
>>
>> Every now and then I miss them. And the rule for this, that I learned
>> in school, is: "if the last letter is consonant, duplicate it". But I
>> found many exceptions for that, so I basically know this rule as
>> something that does not work. When I need it to be correct and have
>> some doubt, I use a dictionary - but that is a pain to do, if for
>> everything I write, and also sometimes unfeasible.
>
> It's about long and short vowels, which in English are taught in terms
> of letter names instead of sounds. Basically, if the last syllable has a
> short vowel (as in pat, pet, pit, pot, put, putt), you must double the
> consonant letter to signal a short vowel when adding a syllable:
> begin-beginning-beginner, tap-tapping-tapper, pet-petting-petter,
> spot-spotting-spotter, gun-gunning-gunner, etc.
>
> If the vowel is long (which in most English dialects means it's a
> diphthong, and/or r-coloured), you must not double the consonant (Bart,
> bait, beat, boat, boot, bite, Bert, bork). Thus dine-dining, not
> dinning. NB that dinner has the short /i/ (as in bit) vowel, hence the
> double consonant. I sometimes see that people have a dinning room in
> their homes, I guess they make a lot of noise while dining. :-)
>
> The above will help if your native language uses the standard Latin
> vowel values.
>
> If you want to know why English spelling is such a mess, the short
> answer is that England adopted printing, and hence standardised
> spelling, before the transition from Late Middle English to Early Modern
> English was complete. Thus many spellings record English both as spoken
> ca 1450-1550 and from ca 1550 on: wind/wind, bow/bow, etc. Or gait/gate,
> neither of which was pronounced as they are now.
>
> Spelling didn't become standardised until ca 1700, but some sounds
> shifted some more: tea once rimed with Tay. Also, around that time, some
> spellings were deliberately changed to reflect the etymology of the
> word: Debt was earlier spelled dette, for example.
>
> And then there are the national quirks, such as the -ise/-ize or
> -or/-our differences between UK and US spelling.
>
> I know this doesn't help as much as you and I would like. :-)
>

Thank you very much for this detailed message with examples and nice
bits of history. I will try to remember that and use it when I have more
doubts.

And the joke is fun. (:
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Re: English: no rule for making "ing" verbs?

Daniel-2
In reply to this post by Balaco
Balaco wrote:

> In English, is there a rule for knowing when we need or not to duplicate
> the last letter of a verb, when writing it in the present participle?
>
> Begin => beginning
> Know => knowing
>
> Every now and then I miss them. And the rule for this, that I learned in
> scholl, is: "if the last letter is consonant, duplicate it". But I found
> many exceptions for that, so I basically know this rule as something
> that does not work. When I need it to be correct and have some doubt, I
> use a dictionary - but that is a pain to do, if for everything I write,
> and also sometimes unfeasible.

Another "rule" of English spelling .... "i before e, except after c" ...
to which, apparently, there are over 900 exceptions!!

--
Daniel

User agent: Mozilla/5.0 (Windows NT 6.1; WOW64; rv:52.0) Gecko/20100101
SeaMonkey/2.49.1 Build identifier: 20171016030418

Go Dallas Cowgirls!! .... Er, Um, ... I  mean "Go Dallas Cowboys!!"
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Re: English: no rule for making "ing" verbs?

Poutnik-2
In reply to this post by Balaco
Dne 08/12/2017 v 00:33 Balaco napsal(a):

> In English, is there a rule for knowing when we need or not to duplicate
> the last letter of a verb, when writing it in the present participle?
>
> Begin => beginning
> Know => knowing
>
> Every now and then I miss them. And the rule for this, that I learned in
> scholl, is: "if the last letter is consonant, duplicate it". But I found
> many exceptions for that, so I basically know this rule as something
> that does not work. When I need it to be correct and have some doubt, I
> use a dictionary - but that is a pain to do, if for everything I write,
> and also sometimes unfeasible.

Perhaps not written, but sounding consonant, similarly as for a/an.


--
Poutnik


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Re: English: no rule for making "ing" verbs?

Ron Hunter
In reply to this post by David E. Ross-3
On 12/7/2017 6:45 PM, David E. Ross wrote:

> On 12/7/2017 3:33 PM, Balaco wrote:
>> In English, is there a rule for knowing when we need or not to duplicate
>> the last letter of a verb, when writing it in the present participle?
>>
>> Begin => beginning
>> Know => knowing
>>
>> Every now and then I miss them. And the rule for this, that I learned in
>> scholl, is: "if the last letter is consonant, duplicate it". But I found
>> many exceptions for that, so I basically know this rule as something
>> that does not work. When I need it to be correct and have some doubt, I
>> use a dictionary - but that is a pain to do, if for everything I write,
>> and also sometimes unfeasible.
>>
>
> Unfortunately, there is no rule that is absolute.  In general, the last
> letter is doubled if it is a consonant AND the letter before it is a
> vowel.  However, your own example with "know" versus "knowing" shows
> that this rule is not absolute.
>
> I am a native speaker of English, born in California to parents who were
> born in Chicago (all in the U.S.).  I have spoken English, written it,
> and read it for over 70 years.  Yet I must often refer to a dictionary
> or spell-checker to determine if I have written a word correctly.
>
Probably the best rule for most things 'English' is to read A LOT, and
then look at the word, and see if it looks 'right'.  Works as well as
trying to remember the rules, and exceptions.  Note that accepted
spellings DO change over time, and this can be very annoying!

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Re: English: no rule for making "ing" verbs?

Balaco
In reply to this post by Balaco
Em 07-12-2017 21:33, Balaco escreveu:

> In English, is there a rule for knowing when we need or not to duplicate
> the last letter of a verb, when writing it in the present participle?
>
> Begin => beginning
> Know => knowing
>
> Every now and then I miss them. And the rule for this, that I learned in
> scholl, is: "if the last letter is consonant, duplicate it". But I found
> many exceptions for that, so I basically know this rule as something
> that does not work. When I need it to be correct and have some doubt, I
> use a dictionary - but that is a pain to do, if for everything I write,
> and also sometimes unfeasible.

Daniel and Poutnik, thank you also for your replies.
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Re: English: no rule for making "ing" verbs?

Jeff Layman
In reply to this post by Ron Hunter
On 08/12/17 08:13, Ron Hunter wrote:

> Probably the best rule for most things 'English' is to read A LOT, and
> then look at the word, and see if it looks 'right'.  Works as well as
> trying to remember the rules, and exceptions.  Note that accepted
> spellings DO change over time, and this can be very annoying!

+1

It is important to remember that "English" is the result of importing,
and often modifying, many words from other languages. Many of these
languages do not even use the English alphabet, so what you see written
is someone's interpretation of how a particular foreign word would sound
if it was spoken from written English. Would it be understood by a
native speaker of the original language? A Russian might understand if
someone reading the word "glasnost" in English said it, but would that
Russian understand the (unspoken) written word itself? This is even more
important with languages such as Chinese where inflexion and emphasis is
important.

We are so used to seeing (and hearing) new words in English that we
native English speakers really don't worry too much if someone writes or
pronounces them in a slightly wrong way. We try to guess what they mean.
If someone meant to use "knowing", but used "knowwing" or even "nowing"
or "nowwing", we'd probably guess what they meant to use. Before the
middle of the 20th century, many who thought themselves superior would
make fun of anyone foreign mispronouncing or spelling English words,
even though the English were, and still are, famous for being hopeless
at other languages. I hope that we are more enlightened now!

--

Jeff
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Re: English: no rule for making "ing" verbs?

Balaco
In reply to this post by Ron Hunter
Em 08-12-2017 06:13, Ron Hunter escreveu:

> On 12/7/2017 6:45 PM, David E. Ross wrote:
>> On 12/7/2017 3:33 PM, Balaco wrote:
>>> In English, is there a rule for knowing when we need or not to duplicate
>>> the last letter of a verb, when writing it in the present participle?
>>>
>>> Begin => beginning
>>> Know => knowing
>>>
>>> Every now and then I miss them. And the rule for this, that I learned in
>>> scholl, is: "if the last letter is consonant, duplicate it". But I found
>>> many exceptions for that, so I basically know this rule as something
>>> that does not work. When I need it to be correct and have some doubt, I
>>> use a dictionary - but that is a pain to do, if for everything I write,
>>> and also sometimes unfeasible.
>>>
>>
>> Unfortunately, there is no rule that is absolute.  In general, the last
>> letter is doubled if it is a consonant AND the letter before it is a
>> vowel.  However, your own example with "know" versus "knowing" shows
>> that this rule is not absolute.
>>
>> I am a native speaker of English, born in California to parents who were
>> born in Chicago (all in the U.S.).  I have spoken English, written it,
>> and read it for over 70 years.  Yet I must often refer to a dictionary
>> or spell-checker to determine if I have written a word correctly.
>>
> Probably the best rule for most things 'English' is to read A LOT, and
> then look at the word, and see if it looks 'right'.  Works as well as
> trying to remember the rules, and exceptions.  Note that accepted
> spellings DO change over time, and this can be very annoying!
>

Being in a non English speaking country, I never even heard about such
changes. Should be annoying, of course.

Thank you
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Re: English: no rule for making "ing" verbs?

Big Al-3
In reply to this post by Balaco
On 12/07/2017 06:33 PM, Balaco wrote:

> In English, is there a rule for knowing when we need or not to duplicate
> the last letter of a verb, when writing it in the present participle?
>
> Begin => beginning
> Know => knowing
>
> Every now and then I miss them. And the rule for this, that I learned in
> scholl, is: "if the last letter is consonant, duplicate it". But I found
> many exceptions for that, so I basically know this rule as something
> that does not work. When I need it to be correct and have some doubt, I
> use a dictionary - but that is a pain to do, if for everything I write,
> and also sometimes unfeasible.

I had an english teacher that said one rule of english was:  There's
always an exception to the rule.

And it's so true. As others have said, you just read and learn from
seeing the right printing.  Rules work sometimes but seeing beginning
rather than begining you just learn that this is the way it should be.

I just found (after age 65) a way to finally get the diner and dinner
thing straight.   Winner of a game sounds like the dinner you eat.  Thus
you go to a diner for a great dinner meal.  I could never get those right.
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Re: English: no rule for making "ing" verbs?

Wolf K.
On 2017-12-08 10:06, Big Al wrote:

> On 12/07/2017 06:33 PM, Balaco wrote:
>> In English, is there a rule for knowing when we need or not to
>> duplicate the last letter of a verb, when writing it in the present
>> participle?
>>
>> Begin => beginning
>> Know => knowing
>>
>> Every now and then I miss them. And the rule for this, that I learned
>> in scholl, is: "if the last letter is consonant, duplicate it". But I
>> found many exceptions for that, so I basically know this rule as
>> something that does not work. When I need it to be correct and have
>> some doubt, I use a dictionary - but that is a pain to do, if for
>> everything I write, and also sometimes unfeasible.
>
> I had an english teacher that said one rule of english was:  There's
> always an exception to the rule.
>
> And it's so true. As others have said, you just read and learn from
> seeing the right printing.  Rules work sometimes but seeing beginning
> rather than begining you just learn that this is the way it should be.
>
> I just found (after age 65) a way to finally get the diner and dinner
> thing straight.   Winner of a game sounds like the dinner you eat.  Thus
> you go to a diner for a great dinner meal.  I could never get those right.

"Phonics" is a misnomer. You were taught letters, not phonemes.


--
Wolf K
kirkwood40.blogspot.com
"The next conference for the time travel design team will be held two
weeks ago."
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Re: English: no rule for making "ing" verbs?

PietB-2
In reply to this post by Big Al-3
Big Al wrote:
> I just found (after age 65) a way to finally get the diner and dinner
> thing straight.   Winner of a game sounds like the dinner you eat.
> Thus you go to a diner for a great dinner meal.  I could never get
> those right.

Most likely you did, otherwise you'd have eaten the diner. ;-)

-p

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Re: English: no rule for making "ing" verbs?

Dave Royal
In reply to this post by Wolf K.
On Thu, 07 Dec 2017 20:36:42 -0500, Wolf K wrote:

> If the vowel is long (which in most English dialects means it's a
> diphthong, and/or r-coloured), you must not double the consonant (Bart,
> bait, beat, boat, boot, bite, Bert, bork)

Thanks for that post, Wolf. Having just looked them up, I now know what
an r-coloured vowel is, and the interesting etymology of 'bork' - which
I've only ever seen in its technical-slang guise.

The other day I was wondering why the http header was 'referer' and not
'referrer'...
--
(Remove any numerics from my email address.)
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Re: English: no rule for making "ing" verbs?

Frank-32
In reply to this post by Balaco
On 12/7/2017 6:33 PM, Balaco wrote:

> In English, is there a rule for knowing when we need or not to duplicate
> the last letter of a verb, when writing it in the present participle?
>
> Begin => beginning
> Know => knowing
>
> Every now and then I miss them. And the rule for this, that I learned in
> scholl, is: "if the last letter is consonant, duplicate it". But I found
> many exceptions for that, so I basically know this rule as something
> that does not work. When I need it to be correct and have some doubt, I
> use a dictionary - but that is a pain to do, if for everything I write,
> and also sometimes unfeasible.

Thread reminds me of some of Mark Twain's quotes regarding spelling.

Here's one I clipped:

"I don't see any use in having a uniform and arbitrary way of spelling
words. We might as well make all clothes alike and cook all dishes
alike. Sameness is tiresome; variety is pleasing."
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Re: English: no rule for making "ing" verbs?

EnDeeGee
In reply to this post by Dave Royal
On Fri, 08 Dec 2017 10:23:38 -0600, Dave Royal
<[hidden email]> wrote:

>The other day I was wondering why the http header was 'referer' and not
>'referrer'...

You could also wonder why Adobe calls the angle quotes
guillemot, which is a species of seabird, rather than the
correct guillemet.
--
Roger
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Re: English: no rule for making "ing" verbs?

The Real Bev
In reply to this post by David E. Ross-3
On 12/07/2017 04:45 PM, David E. Ross wrote:

> On 12/7/2017 3:33 PM, Balaco wrote:
>> In English, is there a rule for knowing when we need or not to duplicate
>> the last letter of a verb, when writing it in the present participle?
>>
>> Begin => beginning
>> Know => knowing
>>
>> Every now and then I miss them. And the rule for this, that I learned in
>> scholl, is: "if the last letter is consonant, duplicate it". But I found
>> many exceptions for that, so I basically know this rule as something
>> that does not work. When I need it to be correct and have some doubt, I
>> use a dictionary - but that is a pain to do, if for everything I write,
>> and also sometimes unfeasible.
>
> Unfortunately, there is no rule that is absolute.  In general, the last
> letter is doubled if it is a consonant AND the letter before it is a
> vowel.

And:  An e after a consonant makes the preceding vowel say its name:
name, game, rate, rite, (pay no attention to "right", which seems wrong
no matter how you look at it), etc.   I would suppose that that rule
works both ways -- a long vowel preceding the consonant requires an e
after it.  If the preceding vowel is short, the consonant is doubled.

Many of the rules depend on which language a word was stolen from.  I
think 'right' came from the German 'richtig' which is pronounced
"ree<strangle sound>..."

FWIW, my English teacher told us that Chaucer's middle English was
pronounced according to German pronunciation rules.  Good to know if
you're ever called upon to recite.

> However, your own example with "know" versus "knowing" shows
> that this rule is not absolute.
>
> I am a native speaker of English, born in California to parents who were
> born in Chicago (all in the U.S.).  I have spoken English, written it,
> and read it for over 70 years.  Yet I must often refer to a dictionary
> or spell-checker to determine if I have written a word correctly.

I never used to have to use a dictionary, but more and more I see words
that, even though correct, just "don't look right" and I have to check.
  My command of grammar is still good, but I see more and more argument
possibilities with certain constructions.

Just another nasty consequence of growing up :-(


--
Cheers, Bev
    "I love to go down to the schoolyard  and watch all the
     little children jump up and down and run around yelling and
     screaming...They don't know I'm only using blanks."   --Emo

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Re: English: no rule for making "ing" verbs?

The Real Bev
In reply to this post by Wolf K.
On 12/07/2017 05:36 PM, Wolf K wrote:

> On 2017-12-07 18:33, Balaco wrote:
>> In English, is there a rule for knowing when we need or not to duplicate
>> the last letter of a verb, when writing it in the present participle?
>>
>> Begin => beginning
>> Know => knowing
>>
>> Every now and then I miss them. And the rule for this, that I learned in
>> school, is: "if the last letter is consonant, duplicate it". But I found
>> many exceptions for that, so I basically know this rule as something
>> that does not work. When I need it to be correct and have some doubt, I
>> use a dictionary - but that is a pain to do, if for everything I write,
>> and also sometimes unfeasible.
>
> It's about long and short vowels, which in English are taught in terms
> of letter names instead of sounds. Basically, if the last syllable has a
> short vowel (as in pat, pet, pit, pot, put, putt), you must double the
> consonant letter to signal a short vowel when adding a syllable:
> begin-beginning-beginner, tap-tapping-tapper, pet-petting-petter,
> spot-spotting-spotter, gun-gunning-gunner, etc.
>
> If the vowel is long (which in most English dialects means it's a
> diphthong, and/or r-coloured), you must not double the consonant (Bart,
> bait, beat, boat, boot, bite, Bert, bork). Thus dine-dining, not
> dinning. NB that dinner has the short /i/ (as in bit) vowel, hence the
> double consonant. I sometimes see that people have a dinning room in
> their homes, I guess they make a lot of noise while dining. :-)
>
> The above will help if your native language uses the standard Latin
> vowel values.
>
> If you want to know why English spelling is such a mess, the short
> answer is that England adopted printing, and hence standardised
> spelling, before the transition from Late Middle English to Early Modern
> English was complete. Thus many spellings record English both as spoken
> ca 1450-1550 and from ca 1550 on: wind/wind, bow/bow, etc. Or gait/gate,
> neither of which was pronounced as they are now.
>
> Spelling didn't become standardised until ca 1700, but some sounds
> shifted some more: tea once rimed with Tay. Also, around that time, some
> spellings were deliberately changed to reflect the etymology of the
> word: Debt was earlier spelled dette, for example.
>
> And then there are the national quirks, such as the -ise/-ize or
> -or/-our differences between UK and US spelling.
>
> I know this doesn't help as much as you and I would like. :-)

:-)

I assume from your name that you are not a native English speaker, which
means you actually had to learn the rules.  I didn't (just picked them
up subliminally, I guess -- I did a lot of reading as a kid) until I
took French in high school.  "Oh, THAT's what a direct object is!" etc.

--
Cheers, Bev
    "I love to go down to the schoolyard  and watch all the
     little children jump up and down and run around yelling and
     screaming...They don't know I'm only using blanks."   --Emo

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Re: English: no rule for making "ing" verbs?

The Real Bev
In reply to this post by Ron Hunter
On 12/08/2017 12:13 AM, Ron Hunter wrote:

> Probably the best rule for most things 'English' is to read A LOT, and
> then look at the word, and see if it looks 'right'.  Works as well as
> trying to remember the rules, and exceptions.  Note that accepted
> spellings DO change over time, and this can be very annoying!

I'm especially annoyed by the fact that "axe" was the proper way to say
"ask" a couple of centuries ago.  I just want to slap people who use 'axe'.

--
Cheers, Bev
    A spokesperson for 60s band 'the animals' has today made a
    public apology saying they were mistaken and there isn't a
    house in New Orleans after all.


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