BBC accessibility site

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BBC accessibility site

Steve Lee-3
http://www.bbc.co.uk/accessibility/

This is not bad but seems a little out of date.
I didn't spot any mention of FireFox features (e.g. accessfirefox.com)
or addons like FiveVox. Also no mention of Orca and gnome a11y options
are rather old. What about NVDA on Windows?

Perhaps someone would like to update them on all the latest goodies?
I'm not really up to date on all the options.

--
Steve Lee
--
Open Source Assistive Technology Software
PowerTalk - your presentations can speak for themselves
www.fullmeasure.co.uk
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Re: BBC accessibility site

Gregory J. Rosmaita
aloha, steve!

i have raised these issues with the engineer responsible for
betsie, but rather than massively overhauling the code behind
betsie (so that, for example, it won't use FONT and other
deprecated and less-than-accessible markup, in favor of a new
approach - webbIE

http://www.webbIE.org.uk/

it is a complete suite of online programs, including a browser
which can switch betwen IE view and a pwWebSpeak-type view
(for those who remember pwWebSpeak) and an accessible RSS feed
compiler, an accessible podcatcher, an accessible online radio
player, and an accessible version of BBC's Listen Again feature,
which -- on the BBC's main site -- is notoriously inaccessible...

interesting note: the aural portions of webbIE use the RealPlayer
engine, but flows it through an EXTREMELY accessible and easy-to-use
interface...

i'm not sure how much -- if anything -- you can do to get betsie
fixed -- i actually volunteered and did mock-ups, but to no
avail...

gregory.
-------------------------------------------------------------------
CYNIC, n. A blackguard whose faulty vision sees things as they are,
not as they ought to be. Hence the custom among the Scythians of
plucking out a cynic's eyes to improve his vision.
                         -- Ambrose Bierce, The Devil's Dictionary
-------------------------------------------------------------------
          Gregory J. Rosmaita, [hidden email]
UBATS - United Blind Advocates for Talking Signs: http://ubats.org/
-------------------------------------------------------------------

---------- Original Message -----------
From: "Steve Lee" <[hidden email]>
To: [hidden email]
Sent: Sun, 10 Jun 2007 19:51:41 +0100
Subject: BBC accessibility site

> http://www.bbc.co.uk/accessibility/
>
> This is not bad but seems a little out of date.
> I didn't spot any mention of FireFox features (e.g.
> accessfirefox.com) or addons like FiveVox. Also no mention of
> Orca and gnome a11y options are rather old. What about NVDA on Windows?
>
> Perhaps someone would like to update them on all the latest goodies?
> I'm not really up to date on all the options.
>
> --
> Steve Lee
> --
> Open Source Assistive Technology Software
> PowerTalk - your presentations can speak for themselves
> www.fullmeasure.co.uk
> _______________________________________________
> dev-accessibility mailing list
> [hidden email]
> https://lists.mozilla.org/listinfo/dev-accessibility
------- End of Original Message -------

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Re: BBC accessibility site

Steve Lee-3
Hi Gregory, I'm not sure I understand how your response links to my
post. My issue is that the BBC site's content on using accessibility
features is incomplete and out of date, not an issue with the
presentation or coding. I'm also not sure what Betsie is.

Have I mis-understood you?

On 6/13/07, Gregory J. Rosmaita <[hidden email]> wrote:

> aloha, steve!
>
> i have raised these issues with the engineer responsible for
> betsie, but rather than massively overhauling the code behind
> betsie (so that, for example, it won't use FONT and other
> deprecated and less-than-accessible markup, in favor of a new
> approach - webbIE
>
> http://www.webbIE.org.uk/
>
> it is a complete suite of online programs, including a browser
> which can switch betwen IE view and a pwWebSpeak-type view
> (for those who remember pwWebSpeak) and an accessible RSS feed
> compiler, an accessible podcatcher, an accessible online radio
> player, and an accessible version of BBC's Listen Again feature,
> which -- on the BBC's main site -- is notoriously inaccessible...
>
> interesting note: the aural portions of webbIE use the RealPlayer
> engine, but flows it through an EXTREMELY accessible and easy-to-use
> interface...
>
> i'm not sure how much -- if anything -- you can do to get betsie
> fixed -- i actually volunteered and did mock-ups, but to no
> avail...
>
> gregory.
> -------------------------------------------------------------------
> CYNIC, n. A blackguard whose faulty vision sees things as they are,
> not as they ought to be. Hence the custom among the Scythians of
> plucking out a cynic's eyes to improve his vision.
>                          -- Ambrose Bierce, The Devil's Dictionary
> -------------------------------------------------------------------
>           Gregory J. Rosmaita, [hidden email]
> UBATS - United Blind Advocates for Talking Signs: http://ubats.org/
> -------------------------------------------------------------------
>
> ---------- Original Message -----------
> From: "Steve Lee" <[hidden email]>
> To: [hidden email]
> Sent: Sun, 10 Jun 2007 19:51:41 +0100
> Subject: BBC accessibility site
>
> > http://www.bbc.co.uk/accessibility/
> >
> > This is not bad but seems a little out of date.
> > I didn't spot any mention of FireFox features (e.g.
> > accessfirefox.com) or addons like FiveVox. Also no mention of
> > Orca and gnome a11y options are rather old. What about NVDA on Windows?
> >
> > Perhaps someone would like to update them on all the latest goodies?
> > I'm not really up to date on all the options.
> >
> > --
> > Steve Lee
> > --
> > Open Source Assistive Technology Software
> > PowerTalk - your presentations can speak for themselves
> > www.fullmeasure.co.uk
> > _______________________________________________
> > dev-accessibility mailing list
> > [hidden email]
> > https://lists.mozilla.org/listinfo/dev-accessibility
> ------- End of Original Message -------
>
>


--
Steve Lee
--
Open Source Assistive Technology Software
PowerTalk - your presentations can speak for themselves
www.fullmeasure.co.uk
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RE: BBC accessibility site

Adrian Higginbotham
In reply to this post by Gregory J. Rosmaita
Hi Steve - BETTSIe was a BBC rendering technology which allowed the user
to filter (on demand) any bbc page in to a single column 'accessible'
format.  I don't recall if it was text only - certainly it was low
graphics with the none BETTSIE versioned pages being referred to as the
'graphical rich' version.

Was it an alternative version?
Yes.

Was this acceptible?
Largely yes, for two reasons:
1. pages were generated in real time so no danger of versioning issues,
2. It came around at the end of the 90s when accessibility support in
Browsers, and assistive technologies was not what it is these days and
for example multi column layouts presented a very significant problem.
 

Re: the current BBC accessibility offering is I think put together in
partnership with AbilityNet and likely as not is targeted at your
average surfer who ;might be struggling to access the BBC site. The info
is intended to give them a few pointers to help them out in the short
term and to prompt them to seak further assistance from specialist
advisors such as AbilityNet.

Interestingly - to those in the education field at least - the editor of
BETSIE is now the accessibility editor of BBC Jam, the BBCs (now
suspended) digital curriculum which had some leading edge accessibility
features within much of it's content and was at least trying hard in the
generic interface eleents. Even going so far in some cases to push
'reverse inclusion' - not alternative versions but need specific
materials, BSL story boarding, Audio 3d mathematical tools, and audible
Scientific tools (not speech output but truly audio interfaces).


Adrian Higginbotham


Accessibility content manager

British Educational Communications and Technology Agency - BECTA
Tel: Direct dial 024 7679 7333 - Becta switchboard 02476-416994.

Email: [hidden email]
Web: http://www.becta.org.uk/
BECTA, Millburn Hill Road, Science Park, Coventry, CV4 7JJ


-----Original Message-----
From: [hidden email]
[mailto:[hidden email]] On Behalf Of
Gregory J. Rosmaita
Sent: 13 June 2007 17:36
To: Steve Lee; [hidden email]
Subject: Re: BBC accessibility site

aloha, steve!

i have raised these issues with the engineer responsible for betsie, but
rather than massively overhauling the code behind betsie (so that, for
example, it won't use FONT and other deprecated and less-than-accessible
markup, in favor of a new approach - webbIE

http://www.webbIE.org.uk/

it is a complete suite of online programs, including a browser which can
switch betwen IE view and a pwWebSpeak-type view (for those who remember
pwWebSpeak) and an accessible RSS feed compiler, an accessible
podcatcher, an accessible online radio player, and an accessible version
of BBC's Listen Again feature, which -- on the BBC's main site -- is
notoriously inaccessible...

interesting note: the aural portions of webbIE use the RealPlayer
engine, but flows it through an EXTREMELY accessible and easy-to-use
interface...

i'm not sure how much -- if anything -- you can do to get betsie fixed
-- i actually volunteered and did mock-ups, but to no avail...

gregory.
-------------------------------------------------------------------
CYNIC, n. A blackguard whose faulty vision sees things as they are, not
as they ought to be. Hence the custom among the Scythians of plucking
out a cynic's eyes to improve his vision.
                         -- Ambrose Bierce, The Devil's Dictionary
-------------------------------------------------------------------
          Gregory J. Rosmaita, [hidden email] UBATS - United Blind
Advocates for Talking Signs: http://ubats.org/
-------------------------------------------------------------------

---------- Original Message -----------
From: "Steve Lee" <[hidden email]>
To: [hidden email]
Sent: Sun, 10 Jun 2007 19:51:41 +0100
Subject: BBC accessibility site

> http://www.bbc.co.uk/accessibility/
>
> This is not bad but seems a little out of date.
> I didn't spot any mention of FireFox features (e.g.
> accessfirefox.com) or addons like FiveVox. Also no mention of Orca and

> gnome a11y options are rather old. What about NVDA on Windows?
>
> Perhaps someone would like to update them on all the latest goodies?
> I'm not really up to date on all the options.
>
> --
> Steve Lee
> --
> Open Source Assistive Technology Software PowerTalk - your
> presentations can speak for themselves www.fullmeasure.co.uk
> _______________________________________________
> dev-accessibility mailing list
> [hidden email]
> https://lists.mozilla.org/listinfo/dev-accessibility
------- End of Original Message -------

_______________________________________________
dev-accessibility mailing list
[hidden email]
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Re: BBC accessibility site

Gregory J. Rosmaita
In reply to this post by Steve Lee-3
> I'm also not sure what Betsie is.

http://www.bbc.co.uk/education/betsie/index.html

that is the original BBC accessibility interface, generated from within
the BBC itself, although the BBC seem to have entered into a newer
partnership with AbilityNet

http://www.bbc.co.uk/accessibility/bbc/partnership.shtml

which may or may not render betsie irrelevant - however, a GREAT
many blind and visually impaired individuals - have their BBC
bookmarks set to point to betsie versions of BBC pages...

and betsie isn't half-bad if you're using a purely text-based
browser and/or a refreshable braille display - it just isn't
very well implemented if you are a high-contrast low vision
user, as it uses FONT, rather than stylesheets...

gregory
----------------------------------------------------------------
CONSERVATIVE, n.  A statesman who is enamored of existing evils,
as distinguished from the Liberal, who wishes to replace them
with others.         -- Ambrose Bierce, _The Devil's Dictionary_
----------------------------------------------------------------
             Gregory J. Rosmaita, [hidden email]
  Camera Obscura: http://www.hicom.net/~oedipus/index.html
----------------------------------------------------------------

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